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He said, "You want to go to the machine shop?" I said, "Yeah." He said, "You go with the blacksmith." He said, "You want to go to the machine shop?" I said, "Yeah." He said, "You go with the blacksmith."
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And I went with the blacksmith. I'd been with the blacksmith And I went with the blacksmith. I'd been with the blacksmith
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And. I'd be job but it was on 3 shifts. In the And. I'd be job but it was on 3 shifts. In the
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meantime. In the meantime the car with. meantime. In the meantime the car with.
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My job my trade was starting back again, you know. And. My job my trade was starting back again, you know. And.
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I try. To appropriate I try. To appropriate
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a little bit with money because tax was - wasn't that good, you know, to work 2 a little bit with money because tax was - wasn't that good, you know, to work 2
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jobs. I used to work 3 shifts over here and work extra jobs. I used to work 3 shifts over here and work extra
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job over here as a builder and started to build and do self-employed job, you know. job over here as a builder and started to build and do self-employed job, you know.
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When you say '3 shifts', what - Well, I worked 3 shifts. That means there is one shift day shift When you say '3 shifts', what - Well, I worked 3 shifts. That means there is one shift day shift
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- they call it day shift - start 20 past 7 and finish 20 past 3. - they call it day shift - start 20 past 7 and finish 20 past 3.
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Then after there were 20 past 3 to half-past - 20 past 11 and there is Then after there were 20 past 3 to half-past - 20 past 11 and there is
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20 past 11 to 20 past 7 in the morning. That's the 20 past 11 to 20 past 7 in the morning. That's the
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3 shift. Then every 3 weeks have 3 shift. Then every 3 weeks have
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1 week - 1 week of the - of the 3 shifts. Day, 1 week - 1 week of the - of the 3 shifts. Day,
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afternoon or night shift. Right. Now, if you are on day shift you start 20 past  afternoon or night shift. Right. Now, if you are on day shift you start 20 past 
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7 and finish 5 to 4. That's - they call it  day shift. 7 and finish 5 to 4. That's - they call it  day shift.
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See, then after is the day shift on the 5 days week. That means there See, then after is the day shift on the 5 days week. That means there
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is no Saturdays and Sundays. Because the day shift you can work day shift on 7 is no Saturdays and Sundays. Because the day shift you can work day shift on 7
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days roster or you can work it on days roster or you can work it on
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a 5 days roster. It's all depends - it's all depends how they work it or what they a 5 days roster. It's all depends - it's all depends how they work it or what they
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need in the - in the - in your department where you work. Anyhow, I liked that job need in the - in the - in your department where you work. Anyhow, I liked that job
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because I didn't come in Australia to show my profession or to show my because I didn't come in Australia to show my profession or to show my
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ability. I want to use my ability, you know, for my ability. I want to use my ability, you know, for my
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prosperity, to put more money. Right. But I don't want to work 3 shifts and make prosperity, to put more money. Right. But I don't want to work 3 shifts and make
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an extra job to show the government how much I make. I want to build up the an extra job to show the government how much I make. I want to build up the
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future of my children, see. And then so I did future of my children, see. And then so I did
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- I bought - I bought
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a house over here with 550 pounds with 2 blocks of land. a house over here with 550 pounds with 2 blocks of land.
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This was a This was a
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pre-war house. It was destroyed by people neglecting this house and they used to pre-war house. It was destroyed by people neglecting this house and they used to
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have it for 1 guinea a week rent, you know.  have it for 1 guinea a week rent, you know. 
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And then after I told them to vacate the place because my wife coming over And then after I told them to vacate the place because my wife coming over
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here. And in the meantime I fixed that house. The next block here. And in the meantime I fixed that house. The next block
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I built the house myself. Did you [?]? Yeah, just down here. It's still - still I built the house myself. Did you [?]? Yeah, just down here. It's still - still
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existing here. When I built that house existing here. When I built that house
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a bloke he bought this - this block a bloke he bought this - this block
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of land and he want to go of land and he want to go
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back to Malta. And he had this - this block and a small  back to Malta. And he had this - this block and a small 
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shed at the back, see, and a few chooks. He said, "I want to go." He said, "I want 300   shed at the back, see, and a few chooks. He said, "I want to go." He said, "I want 300  
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pounds." I said, "You want to go? When?" He said,  pounds." I said, "You want to go? When?" He said, 
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"Next week." I said, "I give you 250 and you go with me and we sign everything now "Next week." I said, "I give you 250 and you go with me and we sign everything now
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before you leave." He said, "That's a deal." I bought this - this land and straight away before I  before you leave." He said, "That's a deal." I bought this - this land and straight away before I 
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finished that house, I started on this house. See, and then after finished that house, I started on this house. See, and then after
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a lot of lands over here that they - they call them overdue rates. see. a lot of lands over here that they - they call them overdue rates. see.
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And after 3 years the council - see, now is 7 years, but And after 3 years the council - see, now is 7 years, but
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before was after 3 years, if you didn't pay the rates, they send you before was after 3 years, if you didn't pay the rates, they send you
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a notice that they're going to send your land. If they make more, they give you the rest. If they  a notice that they're going to send your land. If they make more, they give you the rest. If they 
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make less, you want to pay them there. And we bought a lot of land over here. make less, you want to pay them there. And we bought a lot of land over here.
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See, in the other street over there before there was no street See, in the other street over there before there was no street
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they were block worth 35 pounds each. I bought next they were block worth 35 pounds each. I bought next
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door over here, but this one I bought it after $800. The other one down I bought at door over here, but this one I bought it after $800. The other one down I bought at
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100 - ah, 100 pounds. See, I bought where 100 - ah, 100 pounds. See, I bought where
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my daughter lives over there, I built that there. And I bought - I bought that my daughter lives over there, I built that there. And I bought - I bought that
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135 pounds, see. I bought what  135 pounds, see. I bought what 
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the Maltese Club is with 170 pounds each. And I bought 2 for the club and one for me. the Maltese Club is with 170 pounds each. And I bought 2 for the club and one for me.
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And after - and after a couple of years I bought - I sold - I sold mine for 525 And after - and after a couple of years I bought - I sold - I sold mine for 525
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'cause my wife doesn't want it, see. And in the meantime 'cause my wife doesn't want it, see. And in the meantime
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in - in 8, 9 years I've been here, you know, I acquired 7 houses, in - in 8, 9 years I've been here, you know, I acquired 7 houses,
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see. [? My own age] and had 13 blocks of land, but it's all buy that from  see. [? My own age] and had 13 blocks of land, but it's all buy that from 
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- from the council with 5 pounds deposit. Put deposit and put another 5 pounds a month. - from the council with 5 pounds deposit. Put deposit and put another 5 pounds a month.
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And in the meantime, they pay [? itself] because I can't - I can't afford to pay all the And in the meantime, they pay [? itself] because I can't - I can't afford to pay all the
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payments every month, but where I have payments every month, but where I have
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the land I built a garage myself and I rent it. the land I built a garage myself and I rent it.
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And they used to give me about 2 pounds - 2 pounds rent. That gives me 8. I have 4 2s And they used to give me about 2 pounds - 2 pounds rent. That gives me 8. I have 4 2s
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instalment of the - see, every week, instead of  instalment of the - see, every week, instead of 
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every month. For - for 2 blocks instead of - and that's how I  every month. For - for 2 blocks instead of - and that's how I 
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- but then after a while, my wife reckoned that I have too much and I'm going to pay too much rates. - but then after a while, my wife reckoned that I have too much and I'm going to pay too much rates.
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And I pay for a vacant lot, And I pay for a vacant lot,
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I used to pay only - oh, less than that. For a vacant lot I used to pay about I used to pay only - oh, less than that. For a vacant lot I used to pay about
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5 pounds 5 pounds
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a year. And when I have the night soil, that means that I use the toilet inside, you know, a year. And when I have the night soil, that means that I use the toilet inside, you know,
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we had no - we had no sewerage that day so here used to pay for the beginning about we had no - we had no sewerage that day so here used to pay for the beginning about
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7 - 7 pounds 10 a year. My wife, she said, "It's going to cost 7 - 7 pounds 10 a year. My wife, she said, "It's going to cost
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a lot of money. I want to go back to Malta, I want to." But after 2 years when I  a lot of money. I want to go back to Malta, I want to." But after 2 years when I 
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built this house, she said, "We stay 5 years." Then after she want to go holidays. built this house, she said, "We stay 5 years." Then after she want to go holidays.
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And when we go to Malta for the holiday, she likes it too much, And when we go to Malta for the holiday, she likes it too much,
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but when she come back, she never want to go back again. Yeah. And she said, "Do you want to but when she come back, she never want to go back again. Yeah. And she said, "Do you want to
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take me back after the 2 years?" And now if you mention Malta, she said, "Neither of you  take me back after the 2 years?" And now if you mention Malta, she said, "Neither of you 
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paid the fare for a holiday, I won't go." May I - going back, paid the fare for a holiday, I won't go." May I - going back,
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was it a difficult decision to make? Well, the - And what - what were the - The decision what I had in Malta was it a difficult decision to make? Well, the - And what - what were the - The decision what I had in Malta
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is this; that's - I want to look for the future, especially my children. Because I know the way is this; that's - I want to look for the future, especially my children. Because I know the way
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I were myself when we were with my family, I can't live because I was always  I were myself when we were with my family, I can't live because I was always 
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always a man, a family man that I never dare to have always a man, a family man that I never dare to have
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2 or 3 jobs and always try to find job. And  2 or 3 jobs and always try to find job. And 
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I never - I never bother with distinction. That means  I never - I never bother with distinction. That means 
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- what I mean, that I never say that he's going working with the council  - what I mean, that I never say that he's going working with the council 
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or he's going working carpenter or he is going to be or he's going working carpenter or he is going to be
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a clerk or - no. Wherever I find money from coming, I go and put my head. a clerk or - no. Wherever I find money from coming, I go and put my head.
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Although I never did it, if I find a job as a sweeper in the street that I can make money, Although I never did it, if I find a job as a sweeper in the street that I can make money,
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I'll do it, when I had family. Because when I was - when I I'll do it, when I had family. Because when I was - when I
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was single I always [? lived] with the [?] over there, but when I get married, was single I always [? lived] with the [?] over there, but when I get married,
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I closed my eyes, I said, "Now, I'm the family man. Now, the first time I make 2 or 3 I closed my eyes, I said, "Now, I'm the family man. Now, the first time I make 2 or 3
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jobs a day." See, I - I was a foreman in the - I was jobs a day." See, I - I was a foreman in the - I was
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a foreman in the King George V. I had my own workshop a foreman in the King George V. I had my own workshop
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in Malta to doing some odd jobs, same as I told you before when I was - I left in Malta to doing some odd jobs, same as I told you before when I was - I left
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the shop with what I had although I go and work outside, but after the wars the shop with what I had although I go and work outside, but after the wars
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the convoy start to come in, in the night. If I find - if I find to  the convoy start to come in, in the night. If I find - if I find to 
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make an extra quid, I go. Whatever I can meet if there is make an extra quid, I go. Whatever I can meet if there is
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an extra quid, I go for it. [Barry] When did you get married? [John] I got married in an extra quid, I go for it. [Barry] When did you get married? [John] I got married in
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1940. Right. 40/41. 41 I married, yes. 42 1940. Right. 40/41. 41 I married, yes. 42
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I had my daughter. She's going to be I had my daughter. She's going to be
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- my daughter is 42. She's going to be 43 next July. - my daughter is 42. She's going to be 43 next July.
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And I - I had 9 children all together; 7 in Malta and 2 here, but I still have only 4 [? surviving] And I - I had 9 children all together; 7 in Malta and 2 here, but I still have only 4 [? surviving]
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Who are my brothers. I had 4 sisters and Who are my brothers. I had 4 sisters and
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a brother; we were 6, see. But in that time same was I a brother; we were 6, see. But in that time same was I
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told you. My father, he can't prosper, he can't keep us rich if he want to, told you. My father, he can't prosper, he can't keep us rich if he want to,
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but his mentality was very low. He was but his mentality was very low. He was
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illiterate and he doesn't know what to do with the money. He always been a jolly good illiterate and he doesn't know what to do with the money. He always been a jolly good
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fellow, you know. He like a - if he - if he has fellow, you know. He like a - if he - if he has
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a 100 pounds is very good. If he has nothing, it's just a 100 pounds is very good. If he has nothing, it's just
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the same. When we have, he said, "Come on help yourself because God provided [? this]. the same. When we have, he said, "Come on help yourself because God provided [? this].
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When we hasn't got, he said, "Well, children, no [? ships/shoes] When we hasn't got, he said, "Well, children, no [? ships/shoes]
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nobody got, no profit. I'm sorry, couldn't give you what you want." But not nobody got, no profit. I'm sorry, couldn't give you what you want." But not
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because he can't give us what we want because he wasn't able to use his mind because he can't give us what we want because he wasn't able to use his mind
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because people was - were like my father. And to same because people was - were like my father. And to same
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jobs that they used to jobs that they used to
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work with my father, they had their own house and sometimes they get money in the bank. work with my father, they had their own house and sometimes they get money in the bank.
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Not the first time my father or my mother come and tell my father we ought to borrow for Not the first time my father or my mother come and tell my father we ought to borrow for
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we want to pay the rent. We used to - we used to have 15 - 15 we want to pay the rent. We used to - we used to have 15 - 15
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pounds pounds
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a year in rent and she want - she hasn't got 3 pounds 15 shillings a year in rent and she want - she hasn't got 3 pounds 15 shillings
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to pay for 3 months rent. And last month my father maybe had 100 - 100 to pay for 3 months rent. And last month my father maybe had 100 - 100
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pounds [? in the bank] because he don't know how to manage that money. That's why. pounds [? in the bank] because he don't know how to manage that money. That's why.
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Then after when my brother - my brother, he come to Then after when my brother - my brother, he come to
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his age, his age,
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his - he was 5 years older than me. Yeah, he joined the tug boat, his - he was 5 years older than me. Yeah, he joined the tug boat,
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see, as an able seaman. Until he get married, my  see, as an able seaman. Until he get married, my 
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mother start with the grocery shop. There's no future in it. mother start with the grocery shop. There's no future in it.
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Depression time, nobody - lucky when she sell 4 shillings a day. When she sell it, not when she earned Depression time, nobody - lucky when she sell 4 shillings a day. When she sell it, not when she earned
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4 shillings when she said that, see. Then my father used to go there, 4 shillings when she said that, see. Then my father used to go there,
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too much work, you know, and no profit. Then after when I grow up too much work, you know, and no profit. Then after when I grow up
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I started to use my common sense, you know, and I told my father - my mother because my father was not - I started to use my common sense, you know, and I told my father - my mother because my father was not -
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my mother used to manage everything, "Look, we're not going to stay like this." In Malta my mother used to manage everything, "Look, we're not going to stay like this." In Malta
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we never used to have mortgage or [?] when you made money. You want to borrow we never used to have mortgage or [?] when you made money. You want to borrow
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money, but to borrow money you want to have something to borrow on, something to money, but to borrow money you want to have something to borrow on, something to
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deposit. And when - when they used to have deposit. And when - when they used to have
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money in Malta, I don't know, maybe your parents tell you what they're doing. They are money in Malta, I don't know, maybe your parents tell you what they're doing. They are
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try to buy gold chains or rings or something and they used to bring the box try to buy gold chains or rings or something and they used to bring the box
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gold. The big chains are for the [? cloak] for the old people. gold. The big chains are for the [? cloak] for the old people.
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The big chains, you know, they might cost about 10 pounds that time. 10 pounds was good money, The big chains, you know, they might cost about 10 pounds that time. 10 pounds was good money,
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see. And my father has 3 like that, put them in the box. When they want money, they see. And my father has 3 like that, put them in the box. When they want money, they
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go and say - find somebody got the money and [? pound/pawned] it for about go and say - find somebody got the money and [? pound/pawned] it for about
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2 or 3 - 3 pounds, and it cost 10. 2 or 3 - 3 pounds, and it cost 10.
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That's - that's [? mad living]. That when we grow up, I told my brother, "What are we going to do?" That's - that's [? mad living]. That when we grow up, I told my brother, "What are we going to do?"
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He said, "What do you want to do?" I said, "There is my sister, there's myself. You get that much He said, "What do you want to do?" I said, "There is my sister, there's myself. You get that much
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gold over there." The gold was very   gold over there." The gold was very  
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close. About 1935 will start to come out, see. close. About 1935 will start to come out, see.
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And I said, "What are we going to do?" He said, "What do you want to do? " I said, "What about And I said, "What are we going to do?" He said, "What do you want to do? " I said, "What about
16:15

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all that gold?" He said, "How are you going to bring them? They have money." He said, "I want to all that gold?" He said, "How are you going to bring them? They have money." He said, "I want to
16:22

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get married." I said, "All right. You're going to get married, but we can't bring the get married." I said, "All right. You're going to get married, but we can't bring the
16:27

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the gold." He said, "How?" I said, "Come on, I show you how to bring that gold." Said, "What we're going to the gold." He said, "How?" I said, "Come on, I show you how to bring that gold." Said, "What we're going to
16:34

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do is we go and ask for some gold broken or something. do is we go and ask for some gold broken or something.
16:42

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We sell it. We bring all the money, the value of the money and we pay for it. We sell it. We bring all the money, the value of the money and we pay for it.
16:50

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For what my mother and father own for the interest." For what my mother and father own for the interest."
16:57

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And so we did and we got - the ladies actually used to pound the gold, you know,   And so we did and we got - the ladies actually used to pound the gold, you know,  
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she said, "No, the interest is all - is all over. It's [incorporate] she said, "No, the interest is all - is all over. It's [incorporate]
17:10

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all the - all the value. I said, "No, it's impossible." all the - all the value. I said, "No, it's impossible."
17:18

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Took my mother to a solicitor, the solicitor said, "By golly, where you get that Took my mother to a solicitor, the solicitor said, "By golly, where you get that
17:24

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brains?" I said, "I get that brains or I learn in school." How are we  brains?" I said, "I get that brains or I learn in school." How are we 
17:31

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going to be jealous for somebody that he's billed, see. Don't hate them, but be jealous going to be jealous for somebody that he's billed, see. Don't hate them, but be jealous
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to be better and do this. I said, "Oh, gee." He said, "He's a genius. Come to me." to be better and do this. I said, "Oh, gee." He said, "He's a genius. Come to me."
17:44

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We've been to this lady in We've been to this lady in
17:46

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a short say we get what we want to get. We sold it. We paid   a short say we get what we want to get. We sold it. We paid  
17:53

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for the - for what we borrow. We paid the interest and we get the respect. for the - for what we borrow. We paid the interest and we get the respect.
18:01

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My mother said, "God bless you, son, because we never thought that I'm going to see that My mother said, "God bless you, son, because we never thought that I'm going to see that
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gold again because we never had money to bring that." I said, "No, that's your gold. You might gold again because we never had money to bring that." I said, "No, that's your gold. You might
18:13

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get it back with little  get it back with little 
18:14

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bit less, but you get it all back." And then after from them I get bit less, but you get it all back." And then after from them I get
18:19

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a job myself and we kept going on. And then after I [? make my way] a job myself and we kept going on. And then after I [? make my way]
18:28

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and I kept working and then after the war start, see. and I kept working and then after the war start, see.
18:35

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Changed a lot of jobs. Like, from the dock here I made Changed a lot of jobs. Like, from the dock here I made
18:38

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a volunteer in the Dockyard Defence Battery. I left the battery,   a volunteer in the Dockyard Defence Battery. I left the battery,  
18:42

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disbanded the battery. I been - I been in the police force. Then after I go on the [? train again] disbanded the battery. I been - I been in the police force. Then after I go on the [? train again]
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and the - the [? joinery] again. Then it's happened that  and the - the [? joinery] again. Then it's happened that 
18:56

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when - when I finish from there, I'll be - I'll be when - when I finish from there, I'll be - I'll be
19:02

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in a - the Immigration Department, emigrate to here. And here in a - the Immigration Department, emigrate to here. And here
19:12

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when I saw - when I saw the people, well, first I make when I saw - when I saw the people, well, first I make
19:16

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a decision before - when I heard that the emigration open for Canada a decision before - when I heard that the emigration open for Canada
19:23

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and my wife doesn't want to go. And I told my - and they said they're going to open and my wife doesn't want to go. And I told my - and they said they're going to open
19:28

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for Australia. John Cole, he's in Melbourne; I don't know if you know him. Yeah, I've met him. for Australia. John Cole, he's in Melbourne; I don't know if you know him. Yeah, I've met him.
19:32

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Well, if you - if you meet him again, you ask him for me, John Mallia. Well, if you - if you meet him again, you ask him for me, John Mallia.
19:36

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He said you tell him he was in - I was in the union before, He said you tell him he was in - I was in the union before,
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you see? And he knows me. And he was you see? And he knows me. And he was
19:47

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the Minister for Emigration down there in 1948. He came in Australia to open the emigration, the Minister for Emigration down there in 1948. He came in Australia to open the emigration,
19:53

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see. And he opened that and we start to emigrate in '49.   see. And he opened that and we start to emigrate in '49.  
20:00

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And John Cole was the Minister for Emigration that day. So you had - And John Cole was the Minister for Emigration that day. So you had -
20:10

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No. Before the emigration opened, no. No, because I - I didn't know that I had No. Before the emigration opened, no. No, because I - I didn't know that I had
20:16

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a chance to come. Yeah. See, but when I heard and I saw the people, you know, that it'd be great to a chance to come. Yeah. See, but when I heard and I saw the people, you know, that it'd be great to
20:23

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come out and they want to come here, I'm always was eager to leave Malta because come out and they want to come here, I'm always was eager to leave Malta because
20:29

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I know that there's no future for me in Malta. And what - when I was going to - when I know that there's no future for me in Malta. And what - when I was going to - when
20:36

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I - when - before I get married, that was my worry. I - when - before I get married, that was my worry.
20:43

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If I'm going to grow in that family, how I'm going to live. And my If I'm going to grow in that family, how I'm going to live. And my
20:50

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aim was - always to have my own house, and I achieved that aim was - always to have my own house, and I achieved that
20:57

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goal that I wished that I was in that during the war. goal that I wished that I was in that during the war.
21:05

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Then after there was all [? land] demolished over there with bombs and everything. And I was Then after there was all [? land] demolished over there with bombs and everything. And I was
21:11

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lucky that with 1 - 230 pounds I bought lucky that with 1 - 230 pounds I bought
21:14

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a piece of ground. And I work it out that I spent a piece of ground. And I work it out that I spent
21:20

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600 - 600 pounds and I make 200 600 - 600 pounds and I make 200
21:27

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profit. And that means that I make profit. And that means that I make
21:35

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- build it up with the Housing Commission, you know, the - build it up with the Housing Commission, you know, the
21:42

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- with the war damage. The government give you the money back, but I've done - with the war damage. The government give you the money back, but I've done
21:48

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a lot of work myself, carpentry work and everything, see. And drainage and everything, my a lot of work myself, carpentry work and everything, see. And drainage and everything, my
21:55

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brother-in-law he - he done for me, you know. I give him brother-in-law he - he done for me, you know. I give him
21:59

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a little bit, you know, he doesn't ask me for wages and everything, but I put a little bit, you know, he doesn't ask me for wages and everything, but I put
22:04

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the full amount to the government and I spent 200 - 230  the full amount to the government and I spent 200 - 230 
22:11

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pounds and I get - and I gain another 200 back for my [?]. That cost me pounds and I get - and I gain another 200 back for my [?]. That cost me
22:18

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about 30 pounds, see. And I have my own house. Not very big, but this is about 30 pounds, see. And I have my own house. Not very big, but this is
22:25

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enough for me to live, not to pay any rent or [?]. That was my enough for me to live, not to pay any rent or [?]. That was my
22:30

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aim, but when I heard about Australia and they said that there is that much aim, but when I heard about Australia and they said that there is that much
22:37

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money - and it's not the money; the living. And over there I'm living money - and it's not the money; the living. And over there I'm living
22:44

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on the - on the ration basis, you know. If you want a piece of bread, you can't have more than on the - on the ration basis, you know. If you want a piece of bread, you can't have more than
22:52

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a pound and a quarter, see, every day. a pound and a quarter, see, every day.
22:57

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And Malta will live on bread. Over here when I come, And Malta will live on bread. Over here when I come,
23:03

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I said, "The money is less," but the living over I said, "The money is less," but the living over
23:11

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here all right. I get here all right. I get
23:12

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8 pounds 11 shillings over there, but me and my wife and  8 pounds 11 shillings over there, but me and my wife and 
23:19

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4 children, we used to live on 2 pounds 10. 4 children, we used to live on 2 pounds 10.
23:27

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I had I had
23:28

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100 pounds by the time my wife come here. She sold my place for 400 pounds in Malta. 100 pounds by the time my wife come here. She sold my place for 400 pounds in Malta.
23:35

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She sent me 200 - 250 after that. She give it to me. She paid her fares, She sent me 200 - 250 after that. She give it to me. She paid her fares,
23:42

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she done everything. She prepared to come over here, she spend more. 6 months - 6 she done everything. She prepared to come over here, she spend more. 6 months - 6
23:48

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months after my wife was here, I paid my house and I have another block and I start to months after my wife was here, I paid my house and I have another block and I start to
23:53

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build. And I have no more debt since then. Tell me, build. And I have no more debt since then. Tell me,
24:01

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before you left for Australia, did you have Maltese - before you left for Australia, did you have Maltese -
24:09

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Yes, when I come here I contact him, but he never there, but the trouble is this:  He Yes, when I come here I contact him, but he never there, but the trouble is this:  He
24:15

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never want to - to make an accommodation for me but then up the I don't know why you have never want to - to make an accommodation for me but then up the I don't know why you have
24:21

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make an accommodation because he don't want to tell me he was a deserter himself. make an accommodation because he don't want to tell me he was a deserter himself.
24:27

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Oh, yes. And you see what I mean? Mmm. Because - Where - where was he? Well, he used to live Oh, yes. And you see what I mean? Mmm. Because - Where - where was he? Well, he used to live
24:34

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up here in Warrawong. He was very close to Joe Crussar. Oh. Crussar used to live up here in Warrawong. He was very close to Joe Crussar. Oh. Crussar used to live
24:40

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down here in the bottom. Where you been yesterday. Oh, yes. Well, on this side on the left-hand  down here in the bottom. Where you been yesterday. Oh, yes. Well, on this side on the left-hand 
24:46

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side there's a side there's a
24:47

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stop sign when you come from the street there is - what's-a-name - a bus shed there. Mmm. There is stop sign when you come from the street there is - what's-a-name - a bus shed there. Mmm. There is
24:54

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an old house, brick house, in the - in the creek, that's where - and there was an old house, brick house, in the - in the creek, that's where - and there was
24:59

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a - over there there is full of - a small farm over there belonged to a - over there there is full of - a small farm over there belonged to
25:04

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Joe Crussar. And he used - Peter Mizzi used to live on top Joe Crussar. And he used - Peter Mizzi used to live on top
25:10

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of the hill. And you knew Peter in Malta, did you? Oh, we - I worked for him when I was young, of the hill. And you knew Peter in Malta, did you? Oh, we - I worked for him when I was young,
25:18

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you see. And - Well, when did he come out? He - he come here in you see. And - Well, when did he come out? He - he come here in
25:24

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1946, 47, but he - he used to - before the 1946, 47, but he - he used to - before the
25:31

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war, he worked to Alexandria and then after from there he come  war, he worked to Alexandria and then after from there he come 
25:38

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back. He come back and he joined - he joined the merchant boats back. He come back and he joined - he joined the merchant boats
25:45

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as a chippy. Then he come to Australia. I think maybe he come to as a chippy. Then he come to Australia. I think maybe he come to
25:52

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load the wheat or something like, you know. And then he discovered that he has load the wheat or something like, you know. And then he discovered that he has
25:60

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3 uncles who are here. Yeah, and 3 uncles who are here. Yeah, and
26:07

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he was very cunning, you know. And he told the captain, the skipper he was very cunning, you know. And he told the captain, the skipper
26:16

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he has the appendix. Ah, yes. And he said, "All right." He said, "Well, we can't - we can't he has the appendix. Ah, yes. And he said, "All right." He said, "Well, we can't - we can't
26:23

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do all this and all that." He said, "We'll go to - we want to go to Queensland. We'll leave you here.  do all this and all that." He said, "We'll go to - we want to go to Queensland. We'll leave you here. 
26:30

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You go to hospital, you make the tests. If you need - if you need the appendix, you You go to hospital, you make the tests. If you need - if you need the appendix, you
26:36

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do it, see. And then after we come back in the Sydney do it, see. And then after we come back in the Sydney
26:43

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- Sydney again and we [? embark you from] Sydney." He said, "Yes, sir." He's had a few clothes - Sydney again and we [? embark you from] Sydney." He said, "Yes, sir." He's had a few clothes
26:51

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looking for the passport too because he said, "I couldn't - couldn't stay without  looking for the passport too because he said, "I couldn't - couldn't stay without 
26:55

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a passport." He give him some money. He paid 1 - 1 pound for the taxi to take him to  a passport." He give him some money. He paid 1 - 1 pound for the taxi to take him to 
27:02

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hospital. And then he asked - he asked the - the taxi bloke,  hospital. And then he asked - he asked the - the taxi bloke, 
27:08

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he said, "How much is the - take me to he said, "How much is the - take me to
27:13

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Pendle Hill?" He said, "Another couple of quids." He said, Pendle Hill?" He said, "Another couple of quids." He said,
27:17

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"All right. Take me there." He said, "I have no appendix." He said, "All right. You're happy." And from Sydney  "All right. Take me there." He said, "I have no appendix." He said, "All right. You're happy." And from Sydney 
27:23

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with 3 quids he took him to Pendle Hill, that district, which was good money too. with 3 quids he took him to Pendle Hill, that district, which was good money too.
27:29

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I remember the - what's-a-name - petrol was I remember the - what's-a-name - petrol was
27:36

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about 1 and 3 about 1 and 3
27:42

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a gallon at that time. It's not much. Anyhow, he make his day wages   a gallon at that time. It's not much. Anyhow, he make his day wages  
27:49

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all right with taking to Pendle Hill. And then after all right with taking to Pendle Hill. And then after
27:56

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wrote to him and I told him about. [It like I haven't wrote to him and I told him about. [It like I haven't
27:60

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a clue.?] I told his wife because his wife she was here 15 months before me. I helped a clue.?] I told his wife because his wife she was here 15 months before me. I helped
28:07

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his wife and her 2 children. I helped them and she said, "I'll do my best." his wife and her 2 children. I helped them and she said, "I'll do my best."
28:13

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But when I come here, I find him in Sydney, and every time But when I come here, I find him in Sydney, and every time
28:20

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when I ask him why, he said, "I'll tell you after. I can't tell you now." when I ask him why, he said, "I'll tell you after. I can't tell you now."
28:25

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But he never did told me. Then I - before I know But he never did told me. Then I - before I know
28:33

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by experience. I know by myself what's up because he never want to tell me that he by experience. I know by myself what's up because he never want to tell me that he
28:37

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was a deserter. Yeah. See - see, that's why. But was a deserter. Yeah. See - see, that's why. But
28:45

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that's what happened when he can't - yeah, that's how I want to go. When I saw his that's what happened when he can't - yeah, that's how I want to go. When I saw his
28:50

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wife, Karen, but his wife was only that time when the emigration started wife, Karen, but his wife was only that time when the emigration started
28:56

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for Canada. And that's why when - when I try [?]  for Canada. And that's why when - when I try [?] 
29:03

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but I never - I never had anything before that I want to leave because but I never - I never had anything before that I want to leave because
29:10

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I was a young married man, you know, with I was a young married man, you know, with
29:13

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a young family, you know, and I want to raise it up. And I love my wife very much and my children. a young family, you know, and I want to raise it up. And I love my wife very much and my children.
29:20

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And I never want to leave them. And I never want to leave them.
29:30

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Yes, I did; my wife not. My wife reckoned she'd - she will come with me. Yes, I did; my wife not. My wife reckoned she'd - she will come with me.
29:37

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My mother doesn't want to let her come. But my wife  My mother doesn't want to let her come. But my wife 
29:44

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said, "No. He's my husband and where he goes, I go." She said, "The ship is very small, said, "No. He's my husband and where he goes, I go." She said, "The ship is very small,
29:51

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boat is very" - is true because it was a [? Panamanian] boat, you know. And boat is very" - is true because it was a [? Panamanian] boat, you know. And
29:58

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it took too many - too many onto it, you know. There was about  it took too many - too many onto it, you know. There was about 
30:04

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2000 migrants on a small boat, you know. The Asturias would have been about 1800,  2000 migrants on a small boat, you know. The Asturias would have been about 1800, 
30:10

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but the Asturias it takes over 2000, you know, clearly, you know, with - with 4 [?]. but the Asturias it takes over 2000, you know, clearly, you know, with - with 4 [?].
30:17

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Anyhow, well, and they took - took about 5 weeks to come here. I took Anyhow, well, and they took - took about 5 weeks to come here. I took
30:24

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- we took 28 days. In 28 days we were in the port, and we stopped in - in other - we took 28 days. In 28 days we were in the port, and we stopped in - in other
30:31

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ports 2 or - 2 days and 24 hours. That means  ports 2 or - 2 days and 24 hours. That means 
30:38

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if you want to make it in 20 days, you can make it easy because it was if you want to make it in 20 days, you can make it easy because it was
30:43

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a turbine engine. And you actually - you stopped at Sydney. You disembarked at Sydney. Disembarked in Sydney. a turbine engine. And you actually - you stopped at Sydney. You disembarked at Sydney. Disembarked in Sydney.
30:50

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Well, we stopped - the first - first landing was in Fremantle, then after Well, we stopped - the first - first landing was in Fremantle, then after
30:55

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Melbourne. From Melbourne - we took 4 days from Fremantle to - to Melbourne. Melbourne. From Melbourne - we took 4 days from Fremantle to - to Melbourne.
31:02

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And then from Melbourne we took about 36 hours to come from Melbourne to Sydney. And then from Melbourne we took about 36 hours to come from Melbourne to Sydney.
31:09

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Disembark on Saturday and on Sunday we'll be in - we'll  Disembark on Saturday and on Sunday we'll be in - we'll 
31:16

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been taken to Canberra with train. By train? By train, yes. Took 9 hours. been taken to Canberra with train. By train? By train, yes. Took 9 hours.
31:25

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201. Yeah. Then after in the morning they start to give us the job, they tell us where to  201. Yeah. Then after in the morning they start to give us the job, they tell us where to 
31:32

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work, they give us - if it was the kids, they put them in the tents in the camps, work, they give us - if it was the kids, they put them in the tents in the camps,
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you know. And we all - and we want to walk. you know. And we all - and we want to walk.
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[?] sometimes halfway from where - where you been yesterday, halfway [?] sometimes halfway from where - where you been yesterday, halfway
31:53

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 to go - to go to the dining room because what - what we had is only 1 big  to go - to go to the dining room because what - what we had is only 1 big
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- 2 big sheds. One is - 2 big sheds. One is
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a wash place and the shower, and the other a bigger place like a wash place and the shower, and the other a bigger place like
32:09

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a dining room and kitchen. That's all we had. The other tents [?]. This side is the Maltese; the other a dining room and kitchen. That's all we had. The other tents [?]. This side is the Maltese; the other
32:16

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side Polish. That's how we were. Were you - side Polish. That's how we were. Were you -
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Young. Was it a group nomination? Like, what - were all the 201 all - Well, yes, Young. Was it a group nomination? Like, what - were all the 201 all - Well, yes,
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because no - well, being nominated 200, but when we've been there, because no - well, being nominated 200, but when we've been there,
32:38

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there was one local [?]. He never done anything in his life. He go there was one local [?]. He never done anything in his life. He go
32:45

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and bribe the - the Australian team over there in Malta, had and bribe the - the Australian team over there in Malta, had
32:51

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a couple of drinks in the bar with them, you know. He told them he's a painter. And I a couple of drinks in the bar with them, you know. He told them he's a painter. And I
32:56

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remember when I was remember when I was
32:57

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a child he used to give us 2 shillings to paint his boat. He - he wouldn't be a child he used to give us 2 shillings to paint his boat. He - he wouldn't be
33:04

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able to work, to put his hands in the - in a  - to grab the able to work, to put his hands in the - in a  - to grab the
33:10

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brush in his hands. See, anyhow, but a few drinks change everything. brush in his hands. See, anyhow, but a few drinks change everything.
33:18

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And from 200 they said all right, and he without any - without any And from 200 they said all right, and he without any - without any
33:24

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doctor - doctor visit, without any - anything at all, they give him doctor - doctor visit, without any - anything at all, they give him
33:30

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a piece of paper. Within 2 days he was with us. And now he's a piece of paper. Within 2 days he was with us. And now he's
33:37

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back to Malta last year. He is now today - and he was  back to Malta last year. He is now today - and he was 
33:44

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over over
33:44

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age too because nobody can come over 45. And he age too because nobody can come over 45. And he
33:51

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was nearly 45 or 46. Because now he's over 80 was nearly 45 or 46. Because now he's over 80
33:59

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and he's still alive and [? written] last - last [headed] him back to Malta to live there because he and he's still alive and [? written] last - last [headed] him back to Malta to live there because he
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had his wife and children. He left them over there, you know. And now I don't know, had his wife and children. He left them over there, you know. And now I don't know,
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his wife been in England or died or something, but he went to live with his his wife been in England or died or something, but he went to live with his
34:15

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brother. He's from my - my country town. brother. He's from my - my country town.
34:24

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Yes, yes. Well - What did that mean? Assisted  Yes, yes. Well - What did that mean? Assisted 
34:27

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passage; that means that the government on both sides - Malta will pay something passage; that means that the government on both sides - Malta will pay something
34:32

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and the - over here the Asturias was - was hired by the and the - over here the Asturias was - was hired by the
34:39

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Australian Government. And what we want to pay is only Australian Government. And what we want to pay is only
34:46

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pounds - 10 pounds, I don't know, for the papers or pounds - 10 pounds, I don't know, for the papers or
34:49

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the governments, whatever it is for the expenses, that's all.  And when you leave from Malta the governments, whatever it is for the expenses, that's all.  And when you leave from Malta
34:55

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and you'll get and you'll get
34:55

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a job, the government give you 20 pounds; 10 to pay for your fare, and 10 a job, the government give you 20 pounds; 10 to pay for your fare, and 10
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pounds for pocket money because you left the job because there is no - no work. pounds for pocket money because you left the job because there is no - no work.
35:06

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That's the Malta Government? Yeah, Maltese Government. They give you 20 pounds. They paid your fare That's the Malta Government? Yeah, Maltese Government. They give you 20 pounds. They paid your fare
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for you and give you 10 pounds pocket money. And that's all I had in my for you and give you 10 pounds pocket money. And that's all I had in my
35:17

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pocket 'cause what I had, I left it to my wife and children. pocket 'cause what I had, I left it to my wife and children.
35:25

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The permanent sort of place in Australia was in Canberra really. In Canberra, yes. The accommodation was the work camp. Yeah. The permanent sort of place in Australia was in Canberra really. In Canberra, yes. The accommodation was the work camp. Yeah.
35:32

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Yes. But before us there were people that they Yes. But before us there were people that they
35:39

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came here - they come in Melbourne, but it's not came here - they come in Melbourne, but it's not
35:45

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assisted like we be. Yeah. They  assisted like we be. Yeah. They 
35:48

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- they paid the full passage. And the full passage that time it was about 44 pounds and - they paid the full passage. And the full passage that time it was about 44 pounds and
35:54

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some of them, they come with the P&O some of them, they come with the P&O
35:56

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and they stop in Melbourne. Then after that the P&O and they stop in Melbourne. Then after that the P&O
36:01

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doesn't want - doesn't want to bring any more Maltese because they come with the  doesn't want - doesn't want to bring any more Maltese because they come with the 
36:05

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children and everything. And anyhow, they didn't come here as migrants. children and everything. And anyhow, they didn't come here as migrants.
36:12

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They come here as They come here as
36:13

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settlers to settle here with a full passage. But I settlers to settle here with a full passage. But I
36:20

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was one of the - of the first 201 that comes with the assisted passage in was one of the - of the first 201 that comes with the assisted passage in
36:26

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1949. It's 5th - 5th of February left and 1949. It's 5th - 5th of February left and
36:30

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5th of March we - we reached here Sydney. 5th of March we - we reached here Sydney.
36:38

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Actually in Canberra for how long? Well, I - I stay about  6 weeks in Actually in Canberra for how long? Well, I - I stay about  6 weeks in
36:45

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5 weeks and when I when we,  when we ask Mr Q. 5 weeks and when I when we,  when we ask Mr Q.
36:52

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Eventually, you know, and he said "You can go wherever you like, just stay in the state." Eventually, you know, and he said "You can go wherever you like, just stay in the state."
36:58

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from then on. ??? I told you I come here for the weekend. from then on. ??? I told you I come here for the weekend.
37:07

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Then what I did is only I went back to Canberra and put the notice.  I [? stood] another day,   Then what I did is only I went back to Canberra and put the notice.  I [? stood] another day,  
37:14

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6, 7 weeks, not more, because I stayed there to - to give in the 6, 7 weeks, not more, because I stayed there to - to give in the
37:21

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notice otherwise you won't get the back money. notice otherwise you won't get the back money.
37:28

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How many of the 201 stayed? Over there? In Canberra? Only a How many of the 201 stayed? Over there? In Canberra? Only a
37:34

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few. Only a few of them stayed there. Well, everybody - everybody who can find an accommodation,  few. Only a few of them stayed there. Well, everybody - everybody who can find an accommodation, 
37:40

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he can - he left. And some of them that they didn't know anybody he can - he left. And some of them that they didn't know anybody
37:47

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or they didn't have the guts, you know, to say, "Well, I go to see what's or they didn't have the guts, you know, to say, "Well, I go to see what's
37:54

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happened." You know, they're scared, or somebody - I know people that they have tools and everything, happened." You know, they're scared, or somebody - I know people that they have tools and everything,
38:00

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you know, that they couldn't move, they have heavy tools like machines. They told us you know, that they couldn't move, they have heavy tools like machines. They told us
38:07

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just to bring the machines if we have. Some of them - one of us, they bring the just to bring the machines if we have. Some of them - one of us, they bring the
38:11

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- they bring combination machines, you know, and everything. He left them at the - they bring combination machines, you know, and everything. He left them at the
38:15

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bond in Sydney. And he has nowhere to put them because we were at the camp, but bond in Sydney. And he has nowhere to put them because we were at the camp, but
38:21

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then after they send - they send him a  then after they send - they send him a 
38:23

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bill, you know, to pay - to pay for the machines because they've bill, you know, to pay - to pay for the machines because they've
38:30

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been bonded. And he told them that he has nowhere to put them.  They said, "If you been bonded. And he told them that he has nowhere to put them.  They said, "If you
38:36

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- if you leave them, then you're going to lose them." Then he arrange after a while,  - if you leave them, then you're going to lose them." Then he arrange after a while, 
38:44

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he showed them the papers, what we had that we'd been told by our he showed them the papers, what we had that we'd been told by our
38:50

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government that the government in Canberra told them that if somebody had the government that the government in Canberra told them that if somebody had the
38:55

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machines, you want to bring them. He bring them for nothing, but when they'd been bonded in Sydney machines, you want to bring them. He bring them for nothing, but when they'd been bonded in Sydney
39:02

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after after
39:02

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a while he wanted to pay for the - because they'd been bonded there and he said, a while he wanted to pay for the - because they'd been bonded there and he said,
39:09

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"I'm in the tents. I have nowhere to put it, see." I believe "I'm in the tents. I have nowhere to put it, see." I believe
39:16

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you were also given the impression that you would be able to get your own payouts you were also given the impression that you would be able to get your own payouts
39:23

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Yes, I [? build] the impression that within Yes, I [? build] the impression that within
39:25

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a year we have a house, but when they said we're going to have a house within a year we have a house, but when they said we're going to have a house within
39:29

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a year - 12 months time, my impression was that they're going to give us a year - 12 months time, my impression was that they're going to give us
39:36

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a house. But then after they said that is not eligible for a house, a house. But then after they said that is not eligible for a house,
39:43

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"You are eligible to put your name for the Commission house." I said, "You are eligible to put your name for the Commission house." I said,
39:49

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"What do you mean 'the Commission house'? Does the Commission have - any houses for the Maltese?" "What do you mean 'the Commission house'? Does the Commission have - any houses for the Maltese?"
39:55

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I thought the Commission is the Commissioner. Mmm. Have the houses delivered to the  I thought the Commission is the Commissioner. Mmm. Have the houses delivered to the 
40:01

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Maltese. He said, "No, the Commission houses. There is some houses that they've been Maltese. He said, "No, the Commission houses. There is some houses that they've been
40:08

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commissioned by the government and those eventually told us that's why we bring you.  commissioned by the government and those eventually told us that's why we bring you. 
40:14

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You're here to build the houses to be commissioned to the people. You're here to build the houses to be commissioned to the people.
40:23

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The Commissioner has no houses. The houses you want to build," The Commissioner has no houses. The houses you want to build,"
40:29

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you see. How did the meeting with Ben Chifley come about? you see. How did the meeting with Ben Chifley come about?
40:33

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What was the background to that? How did it happen? Well, it's happened that we What was the background to that? How did it happen? Well, it's happened that we
40:40

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- we find the union over there - we find the union over there
40:42

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when - when they forced us to join the union, you know. In Canberra? In Canberra. Well, they when - when they forced us to join the union, you know. In Canberra? In Canberra. Well, they
40:48

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arrange - they arrange, you know, to have a  arrange - they arrange, you know, to have a 
40:52

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meeting with the - with the Prime Minister over there, the migrants. And they - they reckon that the  meeting with the - with the Prime Minister over there, the migrants. And they - they reckon that the 
40:58

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migrants want to - want to see the Prime Minister and have some grievances, you know, migrants want to - want to see the Prime Minister and have some grievances, you know,
41:05

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to explain to the - to the Prime Minister what's happened. And Ben Chifley, he was that good that to explain to the - to the Prime Minister what's happened. And Ben Chifley, he was that good that
41:14

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we see him in person. Were you one of those who saw him? Yeah. Who were the others, please? Do you remember their names? Oh, well, I we see him in person. Were you one of those who saw him? Yeah. Who were the others, please? Do you remember their names? Oh, well, I
41:21

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forget now the names. One is Spiteri. I remember one Spiteri. I think there was forget now the names. One is Spiteri. I remember one Spiteri. I think there was
41:28

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Dougall. You know Dougall? Oh, yes. Yes, Dougall. One up in Sydney. Yes. Yeah, well,  Dougall. You know Dougall? Oh, yes. Yes, Dougall. One up in Sydney. Yes. Yeah, well, 
41:35

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we - there were 3 Dougalls. There was 1 in Melbourne and 2 in Sydney, but we are 3 together, we - there were 3 Dougalls. There was 1 in Melbourne and 2 in Sydney, but we are 3 together,
41:42

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we came together. That 1 in Melbourne, he was here. He didn't we came together. That 1 in Melbourne, he was here. He didn't
41:49

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pass the test because they give us the test after - after we came. After 4 weeks, they pass the test because they give us the test after - after we came. After 4 weeks, they
41:53

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give give
41:54

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the test. He didn't pass the test and he went to - went to Melbourne, see, Vic. the test. He didn't pass the test and he went to - went to Melbourne, see, Vic.
42:01

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And the other one is the other one Joe, And the other one is the other one Joe,
42:08

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he is married to sister of my he is married to sister of my
42:15

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- sister of my wife's uncle, see. Well, - sister of my wife's uncle, see. Well,
42:22

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uncle of my wife, he's married his wife's sister. I see. Joe. That one, uncle of my wife, he's married his wife's sister. I see. Joe. That one,
42:28

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he is an alderman now. Yeah. And Vic - Vic is he is an alderman now. Yeah. And Vic - Vic is
42:35

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younger than me. I know Vic - I know Vic, a young boy younger than me. I know Vic - I know Vic, a young boy
42:42

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when I was younger. I was about 17, 18 years.  I used to be with his father. We used to when I was younger. I was about 17, 18 years.  I used to be with his father. We used to
42:49

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have the CAVC, have the CAVC,
42:51

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the good [?] Society, you know. the good [?] Society, you know.
43:02

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He likes the drama and everything's like, you know, and also his uncle, you know.  And we were He likes the drama and everything's like, you know, and also his uncle, you know.  And we were
43:07

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young and he was young too. And Vic was - Vic also - young and he was young too. And Vic was - Vic also -
43:14

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Yes, yes, yes. Right. Vic - Vic, I don't know if Joe was there, I didn't remember. Yes, yes, yes. Right. Vic - Vic, I don't know if Joe was there, I didn't remember.
43:22

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I know that 1 or 2 of the - of the Dougalls were there, Spiteri, myself and there was maybe I know that 1 or 2 of the - of the Dougalls were there, Spiteri, myself and there was maybe
43:28

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about 6 or 8 or something. Were you elected by the other Maltese? Well, they said if any volunteers to go about 6 or 8 or something. Were you elected by the other Maltese? Well, they said if any volunteers to go
43:35

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and we go, because there were - there are a lot of people that they - sometimes they and we go, because there were - there are a lot of people that they - sometimes they
43:42

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can't speak English. Or they - they fright, somebody there better than me can't speak English. Or they - they fright, somebody there better than me
43:49

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and they frighten, you know. You actually went to Parliament House? Yeah, we went to and they frighten, you know. You actually went to Parliament House? Yeah, we went to
43:57

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- they seen us there in the corridors in the lobby. We been over there. He said, "What can I do for you?" - they seen us there in the corridors in the lobby. We been over there. He said, "What can I do for you?"
44:03

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See, Parliament House wasn't ready  See, Parliament House wasn't ready 
44:11

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later when they told about some deputation from the Maltese migrants later when they told about some deputation from the Maltese migrants
44:16

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[?] he met us in the lobby. [?] he met us in the lobby.
44:23

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What were the grievances? If that's the right way to put it? The grievances was that we'd been - we are What were the grievances? If that's the right way to put it? The grievances was that we'd been - we are
44:30

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homesick. And he said, "Do you know about them?" And we said no. We show them - we show them that homesick. And he said, "Do you know about them?" And we said no. We show them - we show them that
44:37

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agreement we had with the  agreement we had with the 
44:39

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- as a passport. Every passport with the - with the photographs. I still got them myself. And  - as a passport. Every passport with the - with the photographs. I still got them myself. And 
44:46

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we told them that - what we'd been promised. And I told you already that we told them that - what we'd been promised. And I told you already that
44:54

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he said, "You can take the photo out of it and you know what to do with that piece of paper."  he said, "You can take the photo out of it and you know what to do with that piece of paper." 
44:58

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But he whisper to - I think Spiteri it was, he whisper,  But he whisper to - I think Spiteri it was, he whisper, 
45:05

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but we heard him, see. but we heard him, see.
45:12

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We stand - we left. I think Dougall and Spiteri, they were the 2 that day spoke to him, We stand - we left. I think Dougall and Spiteri, they were the 2 that day spoke to him,
45:17

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you know, on our behalf. And then he said, "Do you understand now?" Everybody say you know, on our behalf. And then he said, "Do you understand now?" Everybody say
45:24

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yes. I didn't left long. When I go to the campfire I straight away over here yes. I didn't left long. When I go to the campfire I straight away over here
45:31

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and he sent me and he sent me
45:32

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a letter. He said, "If you want to come for the Easter holiday, you can come." This is Mr Mizzi? Yeah, a letter. He said, "If you want to come for the Easter holiday, you can come." This is Mr Mizzi? Yeah,
45:38

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Mizzi. And so I did. And I bring another one. He's still - he's still here. Mizzi. And so I did. And I bring another one. He's still - he's still here.
45:45

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Gabriel - he is 1 month younger than me - Chetcuti. Gabriel - he is 1 month younger than me - Chetcuti.
45:49

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I bring him with me over here. And we win I bring him with me over here. And we win
45:56

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back and we come back again and we're still here ever since, me and Chetcuti. One final question. back and we come back again and we're still here ever since, me and Chetcuti. One final question.
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Yes. Could you describe the - the work camp in Canberra? Yes. Could you describe the - the work camp in Canberra?
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What was it What was it
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like? How many tents were there? How many people in each tent? Well, I - 2, 2. We were 200 like? How many tents were there? How many people in each tent? Well, I - 2, 2. We were 200
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and we had about over 2 - over 100 tents over there.  and we had about over 2 - over 100 tents over there. 
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Because we were 201, but there was a few more there. And there were Because we were 201, but there was a few more there. And there were
46:33

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a little bit more on the other side. They were the Polish people, a little bit more on the other side. They were the Polish people,
46:41

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see. And the Polish people, they - they came here in Canberra see. And the Polish people, they - they came here in Canberra
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as a displaced person, not like as a migrant. Yes. And when they came as as a displaced person, not like as a migrant. Yes. And when they came as
46:53

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a displaced person, their wives, they used to take them somewhere in Sydney, I forget a displaced person, their wives, they used to take them somewhere in Sydney, I forget
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now, somewhere in Sydney and their husbands in Canberra. And I remember now, somewhere in Sydney and their husbands in Canberra. And I remember
47:04

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one time when I went in the toilet, see, and they used to bring their wives. We had one time when I went in the toilet, see, and they used to bring their wives. We had
47:11

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2 beds, 2 single beds. And when they come - when they come in the tents  2 beds, 2 single beds. And when they come - when they come in the tents 
47:18

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they come on holidays at the weekends and they used to - to sleep in the middle, the men, they come on holidays at the weekends and they used to - to sleep in the middle, the men,
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and make the 2 beds together and put the wives in the ends. and make the 2 beds together and put the wives in the ends.
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And they sleep together with the wives because they have nowhere to - to sleep. Yes. And And they sleep together with the wives because they have nowhere to - to sleep. Yes. And
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they have no ladies toilets. They have nothing because we are all single men. they have no ladies toilets. They have nothing because we are all single men.
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And I remember one day when if you want to go to the toilet, no  And I remember one day when if you want to go to the toilet, no 
47:51

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 - but the toilets were no doors or like that.  - but the toilets were no doors or like that.
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I didn't even dream of it that I go to the toilet and what it might be like to sit on the toilet. I didn't even dream of it that I go to the toilet and what it might be like to sit on the toilet.
48:04

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I see a woman passing through. And then after I saw I see a woman passing through. And then after I saw
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another man, she goes - well, she find another toilet, you know,  another man, she goes - well, she find another toilet, you know, 
48:15

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[?] and he come with the - he come with [?] and he come with the - he come with
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a blanket and stay like that, you know. Holding it up? Holding it up, you know. But why for she a blanket and stay like that, you know. Holding it up? Holding it up, you know. But why for she
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want to - she want to pass and see somebody. And I never dream when I make like that  want to - she want to pass and see somebody. And I never dream when I make like that 
48:33

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and I see and I see
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a woman instead of man, I don't shy because I - every time the man passing through if not me, the other one. a woman instead of man, I don't shy because I - every time the man passing through if not me, the other one.
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Where was the camp? What part of Canberra was it? Well, it was in the - very close to the  Where was the camp? What part of Canberra was it? Well, it was in the - very close to the 
48:47

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aerodrome in Fairbairn aerodrome in Fairbairn
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aerodrome. Was there any difference in the type of work the Maltese aerodrome. Was there any difference in the type of work the Maltese
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were doing on the aerodrome compared to, say, the Polish people? Well, we didn't work with them. were doing on the aerodrome compared to, say, the Polish people? Well, we didn't work with them.
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We didn't work with them. We don't know what work they be doing because we - we came We didn't work with them. We don't know what work they be doing because we - we came
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as a skilled labourer and they come as a displaced person, but we didn't work together. as a skilled labourer and they come as a displaced person, but we didn't work together.
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I see. That's what's happened. Did you work - I see. That's what's happened. Did you work -
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No, no, we been at Duntroon Military College. I don't know where they did work. No, no, we been at Duntroon Military College. I don't know where they did work.
49:30

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What I know is that the Maltese used to work - used to work - take us with the bus  What I know is that the Maltese used to work - used to work - take us with the bus 
49:37

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at the Duntroon Military College to build the quarters for the - for the cadets. at the Duntroon Military College to build the quarters for the - for the cadets.
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So you didn't work on the aerodrome? No. And then after we start to build also we So you didn't work on the aerodrome? No. And then after we start to build also we
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worked on the Commission houses worked on the Commission houses
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- Commission houses in Duntroon. Officers and people, they live in the vicinity, you know, - Commission houses in Duntroon. Officers and people, they live in the vicinity, you know,
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they give it to them, like Commission houses. Matter of fact, when - when we  they give it to them, like Commission houses. Matter of fact, when - when we 
50:06

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- myself and this Chetcuti over there, first we work - myself and this Chetcuti over there, first we work
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over there and then after when we been to have a trade test again,  over there and then after when we been to have a trade test again, 
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and we and we
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passed the test, then after according to the result, you know, and according to the passed the test, then after according to the result, you know, and according to the
50:29

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papers we had, he said, "1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, you have your papers we had, he said, "1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, you have your
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mate? Yes. Well, you 2  go in that house, you 2 go in that house to make the mate? Yes. Well, you 2  go in that house, you 2 go in that house to make the
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finishing of the houses," you know, because he's - he find that we are good joiners and we finishing of the houses," you know, because he's - he find that we are good joiners and we
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- we can finish the house and make a good job of it. The others, they left them as - we can finish the house and make a good job of it. The others, they left them as
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builders, you know, working on the - the [? rail job] and everything. One builders, you know, working on the - the [? rail job] and everything. One
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of us, he was - he was of us, he was - he was
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a draftsman in the dockyard, you know, and one day we had a little bit of trouble with a draftsman in the dockyard, you know, and one day we had a little bit of trouble with
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2 Irish leading hands, you know. They started to call us bush carpenters because we didn't know 2 Irish leading hands, you know. They started to call us bush carpenters because we didn't know
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the system how they're working here. And he said to me well, when they used to the system how they're working here. And he said to me well, when they used to
51:21

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have the what's-a-name - the uprights and everything like, you know, sometimes  have the what's-a-name - the uprights and everything like, you know, sometimes 
51:28

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the timber used to be like that... We tried to make it straight the timber used to be like that... We tried to make it straight
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with a straight edge and they come and say, "Oh, you are a bush carpenter," because we get the axe  with a straight edge and they come and say, "Oh, you are a bush carpenter," because we get the axe 
51:39

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over there and start to - I said, "What do you want us to do?" He said, "Like this." He get the saw, he start to cut  over there and start to - I said, "What do you want us to do?" He said, "Like this." He get the saw, he start to cut 
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it like that, you know, he push it. We thought we're going to cut  it like that, you know, he push it. We thought we're going to cut 
51:49

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it off. We start to cut it and put the wedge and it comes all right, but we didn't know  it off. We start to cut it and put the wedge and it comes all right, but we didn't know 
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that because that's not our system. We never that because that's not our system. We never
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[? bit] like that, you know. And then after when he called us a lot of names and everything. [? bit] like that, you know. And then after when he called us a lot of names and everything.
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Bloke who was a draftsman, you know, he said, "Listen, you call us a lot of things." He said, "You know  Bloke who was a draftsman, you know, he said, "Listen, you call us a lot of things." He said, "You know 
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us?" He said, "No." us?" He said, "No."