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Language	English (Australian)	“Colour” not “Color”, “Organise” not “Organize”
Contractions	Transcribe as you hear them	“Shoulda”, “Didn’t”
Numbers	Transcribe as numerals	“11 West 40th Street”
Filled Pauses & Hesitations	Transcribe as you hear them	“ah”, “eh”, “um”
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Truncated Words	Sometimes words may seem to be repeated from the end of one line to the start of the next. Transcribe these as you hear them and use your best judgment
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0:00

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This time we're going to, ah, talk about Lake Illawarra. This time we're going to, ah, talk about Lake Illawarra.

0:06

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You've had a fairly long connection with the lake, but what are your first, what were your first connections with it and why did you go there? [Walter] Yes well, I would think that I first became connected with things to do with the lake when I was about 6 years old, probably about 1908 and, I with others, we used to go across to Gooseberry Island on picnics and in later years a hall was built on the island. I don't know whether it's still Gooseberry Island. We know it, I know it You've had a fairly long connection with the lake, but what are your first, what were your first connections with it and why did you go there? [Walter] Yes well, I would think that I first became connected with things to do with the lake when I was about 6 years old, probably about 1908 and, I with others, we used to go across to Gooseberry Island on picnics and in later years a hall was built on the island. I don't know whether it's still Gooseberry Island. We know it, I know it

0:37

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always knew it as Gooseberry Island. Maybe now that it could even have a different lane, but it stands out off Berkeley, the big main island and, ah, always knew it as Gooseberry Island. Maybe now that it could even have a different lane, but it stands out off Berkeley, the big main island and, ah,

0:47

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later again, after the hall was built, I in my teens, with others used to go over there to the picnics to be finished up with a dance which used to last into the early hours of the morning and sometimes because of inclement weather we couldn't even get back then. And, ah, we used to strike all sorts of trouble with our parents that we'd overstayed our leave. But it was a grand place to go because somehow all the later again, after the hall was built, I in my teens, with others used to go over there to the picnics to be finished up with a dance which used to last into the early hours of the morning and sometimes because of inclement weather we couldn't even get back then. And, ah, we used to strike all sorts of trouble with our parents that we'd overstayed our leave. But it was a grand place to go because somehow all the

1:17

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Berkeley people, known as the Fish Town people those days because it was only a fishing hamlet and I think that everyone over there was related to each other. It was only just a small, a small village there and they being all fishing people they all had boats and were able to, ah, to accommodate people who like myself wanted to get over there to these functions. Berkeley people, known as the Fish Town people those days because it was only a fishing hamlet and I think that everyone over there was related to each other. It was only just a small, a small village there and they being all fishing people they all had boats and were able to, ah, to accommodate people who like myself wanted to get over there to these functions.

1:43

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And also we, on several occasions, had a band over there with us, a brass band. The Keira band I remember was over there on one or two occasions when I was there and added to our enjoyment. It was a rough little hall but, ah, it had a nice floor. It had a clearing in the centre of the island around it and we found it and admirable place to, ah, to hold picnic. There was room for rounders and cricket and things like that we as young people wanted to play. And also we, on several occasions, had a band over there with us, a brass band. The Keira band I remember was over there on one or two occasions when I was there and added to our enjoyment. It was a rough little hall but, ah, it had a nice floor. It had a clearing in the centre of the island around it and we found it and admirable place to, ah, to hold picnic. There was room for rounders and cricket and things like that we as young people wanted to play.

2:13

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And, ah, I think that an excellent time was had by everybody. But although the hall stood there for many years, it eventually became the, ah, the target for vandals. I think round about the depression time was when it really started and the ? taken and some of the some of the flooring was taken up and the like until eventually it just disappeared. And, ah, I think that an excellent time was had by everybody. But although the hall stood there for many years, it eventually became the, ah, the target for vandals. I think round about the depression time was when it really started and the ? taken and some of the some of the flooring was taken up and the like until eventually it just disappeared.

2:40

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People they seemed to lose interest in the place a lot I think around about depression time and I don't remember going there after I was, oh, more than about 16 or 17 years old. And that was the last that I really took interest in the hall itself. But many an enjoyable day we had on the lake just sailing boats and row boats. There was a little on no, nothing in the way of launches those times. People they seemed to lose interest in the place a lot I think around about depression time and I don't remember going there after I was, oh, more than about 16 or 17 years old. And that was the last that I really took interest in the hall itself. But many an enjoyable day we had on the lake just sailing boats and row boats. There was a little on no, nothing in the way of launches those times.

3:10

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When I, at different times went out fishing on prawning excursions. I used to go and lend them a hand mostly. I've never, never been a professional fisherman at all. And I never, ever was a licensed fishermen, but I used to go with licensed fishermen. And many, many times I'd go out of a night. But how different it was then to what it is now when they scratch around now to try and get a few pounds of prawns. I think that this could easily be substantiated by some of the When I, at different times went out fishing on prawning excursions. I used to go and lend them a hand mostly. I've never, never been a professional fisherman at all. And I never, ever was a licensed fishermen, but I used to go with licensed fishermen. And many, many times I'd go out of a night. But how different it was then to what it is now when they scratch around now to try and get a few pounds of prawns. I think that this could easily be substantiated by some of the

3:41

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older fisherman. I think that perhaps maybe you'll have the luck to be able to interview some of them, some of the Masseys, or some of them I think that who would have been around at that time. Unfortunately, a lot of them are dead. I know that a lot of them are not with us anymore, but you might still find people I think like, ah, like some of the Dennis's who would still be able to substantiate what I say. Not that I would depart in any way from the truth in what I say. older fisherman. I think that perhaps maybe you'll have the luck to be able to interview some of them, some of the Masseys, or some of them I think that who would have been around at that time. Unfortunately, a lot of them are dead. I know that a lot of them are not with us anymore, but you might still find people I think like, ah, like some of the Dennis's who would still be able to substantiate what I say. Not that I would depart in any way from the truth in what I say.

4:12

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To reiterate, whilst they used to, whilst they scratch around now for a pound of prawns, those times it was possible to go out with an early night To reiterate, whilst they used to, whilst they scratch around now for a pound of prawns, those times it was possible to go out with an early night

4:23

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and they'd get their what they call a tally, 10 boxes of prawns. And when they had their 10 boxes of prawns they would come in, because in their wisdom they would try to maintain some kind of market and try to avoid a glut. I used to go, I often went with the old Kellys. Unfortunately they're not with us either anymore. They're well known to lots of people on the waterfront because they themselves were both members of the Waterside Workers' Federation, and they'd get their what they call a tally, 10 boxes of prawns. And when they had their 10 boxes of prawns they would come in, because in their wisdom they would try to maintain some kind of market and try to avoid a glut. I used to go, I often went with the old Kellys. Unfortunately they're not with us either anymore. They're well known to lots of people on the waterfront because they themselves were both members of the Waterside Workers' Federation,

4:54

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two, two gentlemen really, real gentleman. But, ah, two, two gentlemen really, real gentleman. But, ah,

4:59

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I'd go with them and I'd go with them and

5:03

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an early night we'd go out amongst these prawns an early night we'd go out amongst these prawns

5:07

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and when things were quiet and we'd settle anywhere around what we used to call the crown head at the top end of the channel here or down along the flat and to hear these prawns travel, you would hear them like a hail storm on the water. But a couple of shots and they'd have all the prawns they needed. As I said before 10 boxes, they used to seem to think that 10 boxes was reasonable. I think that they never got more than around about what used to be a pound those and when things were quiet and we'd settle anywhere around what we used to call the crown head at the top end of the channel here or down along the flat and to hear these prawns travel, you would hear them like a hail storm on the water. But a couple of shots and they'd have all the prawns they needed. As I said before 10 boxes, they used to seem to think that 10 boxes was reasonable. I think that they never got more than around about what used to be a pound those

5:38

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times, $2 I think a pound, a pound a box that they used to get for them. But they were so easily got and it wasn't hard to get them and be in by midnight in the summertime, which is only a very short few hours work. We'd take them in on the shore on the eastern side of the lake to where they'd have a half tank filled with salt, half filled with salt water and plenty of wood in readiness. times, $2 I think a pound, a pound a box that they used to get for them. But they were so easily got and it wasn't hard to get them and be in by midnight in the summertime, which is only a very short few hours work. We'd take them in on the shore on the eastern side of the lake to where they'd have a half tank filled with salt, half filled with salt water and plenty of wood in readiness.

6:06

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I'd give them a hand to carry their prawns ashore, I'd give them a hand to carry their prawns ashore,

6:10

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we'd light the fire up and boil the water up and bundle these prawns in, and we'd sit around on this buffalo grass. There was a lovely patch of buffalo grass there, probably half an acre that they used to use there. And we'd watch them until they boiled and then they'd scoop them off the top and spread them on this lovely lawn of buffalo grass, sprinkle them with coarse salt. And then we'd have invitations, sometimes there'd be more than me, there'd be other people with me. we'd light the fire up and boil the water up and bundle these prawns in, and we'd sit around on this buffalo grass. There was a lovely patch of buffalo grass there, probably half an acre that they used to use there. And we'd watch them until they boiled and then they'd scoop them off the top and spread them on this lovely lawn of buffalo grass, sprinkle them with coarse salt. And then we'd have invitations, sometimes there'd be more than me, there'd be other people with me.

6:40

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Sometimes they would time it so that they would come down when the fishermen came in, to sit around this big fire with this great area covered with prawns, cooked prawns, and we'd be invited to eat as many as we possibly could, and then of course in their generosity to take as many home as we needed. And that went on every time that I would go there. They were two gentlemen. But those times of course prawns were not valuable like they are today. Sometimes they would time it so that they would come down when the fishermen came in, to sit around this big fire with this great area covered with prawns, cooked prawns, and we'd be invited to eat as many as we possibly could, and then of course in their generosity to take as many home as we needed. And that went on every time that I would go there. They were two gentlemen. But those times of course prawns were not valuable like they are today.

7:10

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You gotta say these things. I used to go with Billy Hooper. His son later was on the waterfront too, but he never was himself, he was a fisherman. And I found the same treatment. I mean, we'd ? guide going with him and round about a tally, about 10 boxes, and we'd come in, cook them, spread them. You gotta say these things. I used to go with Billy Hooper. His son later was on the waterfront too, but he never was himself, he was a fisherman. And I found the same treatment. I mean, we'd ? guide going with him and round about a tally, about 10 boxes, and we'd come in, cook them, spread them.

7:32

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peel them all and then into them, [laughs] and eat what we could, take home what we needed. And that was the order of the day. But things are very much different today when we see them as I said before, scratching around, trying to get a pound or two now. peel them all and then into them, [laughs] and eat what we could, take home what we needed. And that was the order of the day. But things are very much different today when we see them as I said before, scratching around, trying to get a pound or two now.

7:48

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Is there anything else that I, you'd like me to add to it? [Glenn] Well, um, what about, ah, fishing in the lake? [Walter] Yes, well I've fished in the lake ever since I was big enough. Is there anything else that I, you'd like me to add to it? [Glenn] Well, um, what about, ah, fishing in the lake? [Walter] Yes, well I've fished in the lake ever since I was big enough.

7:59

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And I think that, ah, my memory goes back to when I was about, oh, 10 years old, I think, I well remember. I well remember when I was about 10 years old when I used to go out with one of my uncles and we'd leave the, the boat was always kept And I think that, ah, my memory goes back to when I was about, oh, 10 years old, I think, I well remember. I well remember when I was about 10 years old when I used to go out with one of my uncles and we'd leave the, the boat was always kept

8:18

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on the northern end on the northern end

8:20

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of the bay. of the bay.

8:23

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Kully Bay I think it is called now, we used to call it Kelly's Bay at those times. And that would be somewhere in the vicinity of where Kmart and Woolworths are there now at that end of the bay. But the bay then was not like it is today either, because I well remember that the bay was a beautiful place. It was a haven and it had a white sandy bottom. Today it's a slurry of Kully Bay I think it is called now, we used to call it Kelly's Bay at those times. And that would be somewhere in the vicinity of where Kmart and Woolworths are there now at that end of the bay. But the bay then was not like it is today either, because I well remember that the bay was a beautiful place. It was a haven and it had a white sandy bottom. Today it's a slurry of

8:53

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mud and weed, probably knee deep in mud and covered with weed. mud and weed, probably knee deep in mud and covered with weed.

8:58

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But I, ah, I'd go in company with this uncle of mine who owned a boat and we'd set off down towards the ?? But I used to like to lie on the bow of the boat as we went out through the bay, through the entrance of the bay. And I used to see flathead of all sizes scurrying away from under the bow of the boat off this white sand, which is now so full of mud and slush and weed. And I find it hard to believe that things were really so nice and what they But I, ah, I'd go in company with this uncle of mine who owned a boat and we'd set off down towards the ?? But I used to like to lie on the bow of the boat as we went out through the bay, through the entrance of the bay. And I used to see flathead of all sizes scurrying away from under the bow of the boat off this white sand, which is now so full of mud and slush and weed. And I find it hard to believe that things were really so nice and what they

9:30

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used to be. But it was never very necessary to go too far away. We found that this crown head I speak of that is right opposite, it's the shallow right opposite the Yacht Club, the Port Kembla Yacht Club. There's a channel in between the Yacht Club and out for some 100 yards distance or a little more perhaps there's a shallow and it's never been more than something like ?? deep there and we always knew it as the crown head. But, ah, anywhere in that used to be. But it was never very necessary to go too far away. We found that this crown head I speak of that is right opposite, it's the shallow right opposite the Yacht Club, the Port Kembla Yacht Club. There's a channel in between the Yacht Club and out for some 100 yards distance or a little more perhaps there's a shallow and it's never been more than something like ?? deep there and we always knew it as the crown head. But, ah, anywhere in that

10:01

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vicinity from there downwards for maybe a 1/4 mile or so was all that was necessary to go to get all the fish that we required. There was always plenty of flathead, red bream, tailor to be caught and a lot of trumpet and whiting and things like that. But you were always assured of fish because the lake vicinity from there downwards for maybe a 1/4 mile or so was all that was necessary to go to get all the fish that we required. There was always plenty of flathead, red bream, tailor to be caught and a lot of trumpet and whiting and things like that. But you were always assured of fish because the lake

10:22

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with fish, it was the same with fish as it was with prawns, it used to teem with fish and there was never, there was never any problem to catch fish in it. with fish, it was the same with fish as it was with prawns, it used to teem with fish and there was never, there was never any problem to catch fish in it.

10:31

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[Glenn] And the condition of the lake has changed a bit too. [Walter] The condition has changed. Unfortunately that weed that we speak of, it seems to me that it must come with some form of pollution I think. But, ah, I don't know for how many years these places went by without weed, but that particular weed that I speak of is not ribbon weed or bootlace as we know it. But at that time the only weed we would see [Glenn] And the condition of the lake has changed a bit too. [Walter] The condition has changed. Unfortunately that weed that we speak of, it seems to me that it must come with some form of pollution I think. But, ah, I don't know for how many years these places went by without weed, but that particular weed that I speak of is not ribbon weed or bootlace as we know it. But at that time the only weed we would see

11:01

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would be bootlace weed and it seems to grow in small clumps and it doesn't seem to thrive so much because it leaves vast areas of sand patches. But with this other stuff that we have in there now there's what they call slime weed now. would be bootlace weed and it seems to grow in small clumps and it doesn't seem to thrive so much because it leaves vast areas of sand patches. But with this other stuff that we have in there now there's what they call slime weed now.

11:19

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Maybe some of it blackfish weed they might call it too in it's best day, but Maybe some of it blackfish weed they might call it too in it's best day, but

11:24

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it seems to have taken over and completely destroyed a lot of the fishing that we used to have. A lot of the nice sandy patches are nothing more than weed beds there now of slimy weed. But I think that there I noticed that change come to the bay, particularly when the population commenced here. And I've always thought, just my way of thinking, that as people shift in and it seems to have taken over and completely destroyed a lot of the fishing that we used to have. A lot of the nice sandy patches are nothing more than weed beds there now of slimy weed. But I think that there I noticed that change come to the bay, particularly when the population commenced here. And I've always thought, just my way of thinking, that as people shift in and

11:54

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make their homes around the shores of the lake that they remove the, the grass areas. And as they start to garden, particularly in this area around here where it's so hilly, I think that once they remove the natural grass from the place that, ah, storms, heavy rain and the like they come along and they carry a lot of the topsoil, probably mixed with fertilisers and all kinds of stuff make their homes around the shores of the lake that they remove the, the grass areas. And as they start to garden, particularly in this area around here where it's so hilly, I think that once they remove the natural grass from the place that, ah, storms, heavy rain and the like they come along and they carry a lot of the topsoil, probably mixed with fertilisers and all kinds of stuff

12:26

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and all that good soil is taken, or a large quantity was taken, from all the surrounding hills and, ah, it's to be taken down the stormwater channels and down the gullies and finishes up down in the bay. and all that good soil is taken, or a large quantity was taken, from all the surrounding hills and, ah, it's to be taken down the stormwater channels and down the gullies and finishes up down in the bay.

12:43

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And I think that, ah, And I think that, ah,

12:45

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for many years it was totally different to that when all these hills for many years it was totally different to that when all these hills

12:51

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were coated with a nice green grass. And I've been round the shores of the lake were coated with a nice green grass. And I've been round the shores of the lake

12:57

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after heavy rain to see water running down the sides of the slopes, days after, and still nice and clear, clear enough to drink after heavy rain to see water running down the sides of the slopes, days after, and still nice and clear, clear enough to drink

13:07

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after running off the, the clean grassy hills. And I think that all that changed when the population of the place grew to what it is today. And I do believe that the subsoil from the, the topsoil, I mean to say, from the gardens has been carried down, down to the lake, which is the lowest point after running off the, the clean grassy hills. And I think that all that changed when the population of the place grew to what it is today. And I do believe that the subsoil from the, the topsoil, I mean to say, from the gardens has been carried down, down to the lake, which is the lowest point

13:30

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to find its way into the bay particularly and maybe along the other foreshores too to find its way into the bay particularly and maybe along the other foreshores too

13:36

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and to the detriment of the lake and to the advantage of the, of this pest week that we talk about. and to the detriment of the lake and to the advantage of the, of this pest week that we talk about.

13:45

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[Glenn] There's been some things written recently about the smelting works over here in Dapto, um, the old smelting works. [Walter] Yes. [Glenn] Um, [Glenn] There's been some things written recently about the smelting works over here in Dapto, um, the old smelting works. [Walter] Yes. [Glenn] Um,

13:55

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and they've had a look at the, the contents of the bottom of the lake just around that area and it looks as though there, that that smelting works put some rubbish into the lake. Do you, do you know anything about that or..? [Walter] No, I must confess that I didn't know anything of it. I haven't even read of it. But of course and they've had a look at the, the contents of the bottom of the lake just around that area and it looks as though there, that that smelting works put some rubbish into the lake. Do you, do you know anything about that or..? [Walter] No, I must confess that I didn't know anything of it. I haven't even read of it. But of course

14:13

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I'd have to be, ah, I'd have to be joking if I wouldn't believe something like that, because if I said I didn't believe something like that, because I think that whatever there's industry, particularly in the good old days, I think that, ah, there's sure to have been pollution, uncontrolled pollution. And if you speak about minerals and things that were just washed into the lake, I fear from these industries, I feel sure that it would have to be so. [Glenn] You were saying before about the sanitary dump, the garbage dump I'd have to be, ah, I'd have to be joking if I wouldn't believe something like that, because if I said I didn't believe something like that, because I think that whatever there's industry, particularly in the good old days, I think that, ah, there's sure to have been pollution, uncontrolled pollution. And if you speak about minerals and things that were just washed into the lake, I fear from these industries, I feel sure that it would have to be so. [Glenn] You were saying before about the sanitary dump, the garbage dump

14:45

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with the with the

14:46

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???Family films degree. [Walter] Yes, well, since you asked me, let's take a walk on a nice bright morning as I used to do. Starting off from somewhere around about Hill 60, I used to live over in that direction. I'd only be young at the time and I remember when I used to be no more than about 12 years old I used to start to walk. We'd set out on a nice bright morning to walk to the lake's entrance and I used to think it was grand. We could have ridden on horseback ???Family films degree. [Walter] Yes, well, since you asked me, let's take a walk on a nice bright morning as I used to do. Starting off from somewhere around about Hill 60, I used to live over in that direction. I'd only be young at the time and I remember when I used to be no more than about 12 years old I used to start to walk. We'd set out on a nice bright morning to walk to the lake's entrance and I used to think it was grand. We could have ridden on horseback

15:16

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or perhaps we could have gone in the sulky down the old heavy sand track, but somehow I used to get more fun out of walking down. or perhaps we could have gone in the sulky down the old heavy sand track, but somehow I used to get more fun out of walking down.

15:24

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So we'd saunter across from Hill 60 over the bare hill to Coomaditchy. There was no house there then, nobody lived there So we'd saunter across from Hill 60 over the bare hill to Coomaditchy. There was no house there then, nobody lived there

15:35

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And, ah, the Coomaditchy swamp itself And, ah, the Coomaditchy swamp itself

15:38

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to me it used to be a joy to see it to me it used to be a joy to see it

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with its, ah, flocks of with its, ah, flocks of

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waterbirds, waterbirds,

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always ducks, flocks of ducks, always ducks, flocks of ducks,

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waterhen, coots, as we called them, red bill around the edges. waterhen, coots, as we called them, red bill around the edges.

15:56

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The only dwelling in sight from there The only dwelling in sight from there

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would be would be

16:01

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a farmhouse on the western end of Coomaditchy. a farmhouse on the western end of Coomaditchy.

16:06

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And then, ah, we leave the swamp behind us and go up over the bank And then, ah, we leave the swamp behind us and go up over the bank

16:12

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still going south in the direction of the lake's entrance. still going south in the direction of the lake's entrance.

16:18

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When, ah, reaching the When, ah, reaching the

16:21

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top of the bank of Coomaditchy on the southern side, we'd get into the most delightful area I used to think there. We'd find ourselves amongst great patches of flannel flower. top of the bank of Coomaditchy on the southern side, we'd get into the most delightful area I used to think there. We'd find ourselves amongst great patches of flannel flower.

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of ??? of ???

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which we called the wild flowering peach. which we called the wild flowering peach.

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Veronia, great areas of it Veronia, great areas of it

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right down for right down for

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200 or 300 yards until we came to another small swamp. And in this swamp although it was a more secluded little place, 200 or 300 yards until we came to another small swamp. And in this swamp although it was a more secluded little place,

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it didn't cover more than, an area of more than perhaps half an acre, but there was usually it didn't cover more than, an area of more than perhaps half an acre, but there was usually

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water birds in there, water fowl too. water birds in there, water fowl too.

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But to go on down then another half a mile or so But to go on down then another half a mile or so

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we would come to this particular breeding spot. I think it must have been a breeding area for most of the water and waterfowl in the locality we would come to this particular breeding spot. I think it must have been a breeding area for most of the water and waterfowl in the locality

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because I used myself to walk through it sometimes and I'd be astounded at the amount of wild duck that would be in it with their young ones travelling around, the mother duck with its little group of ducklings and rushing around. I used to try to catch the ducklings and I don't remember ever catching one. But, ah, from then on we would walk down to round about to Koorongulla Crescent and from then on we would find ourselves because I used myself to walk through it sometimes and I'd be astounded at the amount of wild duck that would be in it with their young ones travelling around, the mother duck with its little group of ducklings and rushing around. I used to try to catch the ducklings and I don't remember ever catching one. But, ah, from then on we would walk down to round about to Koorongulla Crescent and from then on we would find ourselves

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in real forest country. in real forest country.

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There was a hardwood forest stretching from there three parts of the way down to the entrance. And this hardwood forest comprised There was a hardwood forest stretching from there three parts of the way down to the entrance. And this hardwood forest comprised

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big Blackbutt trees, Bloodwood, Stringybark and, ah, some Blue gum and honeysuckle. big Blackbutt trees, Bloodwood, Stringybark and, ah, some Blue gum and honeysuckle.

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But why I mentioned them mainly is the fact that, ah, But why I mentioned them mainly is the fact that, ah,

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this place was always a home for so much bird life. this place was always a home for so much bird life.

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The trees, all the trees, but, ah, particularly when they were blossoming, would be covered with birds. The little green, the green ?? parakeet would travel around in swarms and I'd see them on the blossom of the Bloodwood trees along with the collared lorikeet that we see so much of up towards the Gold Coast and places further north. But they were in abundance, leather heads and then on the blossoms there were The trees, all the trees, but, ah, particularly when they were blossoming, would be covered with birds. The little green, the green ?? parakeet would travel around in swarms and I'd see them on the blossom of the Bloodwood trees along with the collared lorikeet that we see so much of up towards the Gold Coast and places further north. But they were in abundance, leather heads and then on the blossoms there were

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also. And then as we went, went along through the honeysuckle we'd find gillbirds, swarms of gillbirds. There was always a great abundance of bird life always, and the gillbirds on the honeysuckle, feeding on the honeysuckle and some bottlebrush. But this forest it run along behind where the Port Kembla Golf links is, Golf Links are now. And it took us away down to somewhere around about also. And then as we went, went along through the honeysuckle we'd find gillbirds, swarms of gillbirds. There was always a great abundance of bird life always, and the gillbirds on the honeysuckle, feeding on the honeysuckle and some bottlebrush. But this forest it run along behind where the Port Kembla Golf links is, Golf Links are now. And it took us away down to somewhere around about

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opposite the Beachcomber Caravan area where we would break through this forest then. The forest was some, had a good depth more so than what we're likely to realise now. The sand has crept across a lot of it and covered it in. But from the little track that used to, ah, opposite the Beachcomber Caravan area where we would break through this forest then. The forest was some, had a good depth more so than what we're likely to realise now. The sand has crept across a lot of it and covered it in. But from the little track that used to, ah,

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that we used to use to go through there you could walk I would say 300 or 400 yards through this forest in an easterly direction before coming to the sand hills at that time. And it's much different now, there's just a, a rim of trees there if any along the edge, the others have been covered with sand I think. But after getting down somewhere around well, we'll say the Beachcomber area and in on the beach side, we'd break through this forest and, ah, we'd that we used to use to go through there you could walk I would say 300 or 400 yards through this forest in an easterly direction before coming to the sand hills at that time. And it's much different now, there's just a, a rim of trees there if any along the edge, the others have been covered with sand I think. But after getting down somewhere around well, we'll say the Beachcomber area and in on the beach side, we'd break through this forest and, ah, we'd

20:18

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find ourselves in open area and, ah, grassy area with lots of prickly pear. And through this prickly pear we'd find these great rabbit warrens. They'd have it literally honeycombed and there was an abundance of rabbits there. find ourselves in open area and, ah, grassy area with lots of prickly pear. And through this prickly pear we'd find these great rabbit warrens. They'd have it literally honeycombed and there was an abundance of rabbits there.

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However, then on down another half a mile or so to the entrance, and that was really the end of the road literally because there was no way of getting across onto the other side and we still, since there was no bridge there However, then on down another half a mile or so to the entrance, and that was really the end of the road literally because there was no way of getting across onto the other side and we still, since there was no bridge there

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the one thing, the one bright spot, that there was always a spring at the end of the walk, a natural spring of fresh water. Someone was good enough, even as far back as those years I speak of, the one thing, the one bright spot, that there was always a spring at the end of the walk, a natural spring of fresh water. Someone was good enough, even as far back as those years I speak of,

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to place a large wooden cask in the ground and we always had something, some nice clean drinking water at the end of the journey. But to stand and look from there, it'd be somewhere around the vicinity, this water spring that I speak of, to place a large wooden cask in the ground and we always had something, some nice clean drinking water at the end of the journey. But to stand and look from there, it'd be somewhere around the vicinity, this water spring that I speak of,

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I would say about the last pine tree down I would say about the last pine tree down

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starting from the bridge and going down towards the entrance, it would be somewhere around about the last pine tree to be planted, starting from the bridge and going down towards the entrance, it would be somewhere around about the last pine tree to be planted,

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somewhere around to where the toilets are somewhere around to where the toilets are

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situated now. I don't think there's any trace of a spring there of any description now. situated now. I don't think there's any trace of a spring there of any description now.

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But the part we started to speak of first, I deplore the destruction of this place But the part we started to speak of first, I deplore the destruction of this place

21:54

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because, ah, I used to really love that walk down through there. I used think it was really something. But I think lots of people were dismayed later when they found that the Council had decided to start a sanitary depot and that would be somewhere around where the bypass and Warrawong reaches the old Lake Road. And that was the first one, later to be extended further south and catch not only the northern end, but catch the because, ah, I used to really love that walk down through there. I used think it was really something. But I think lots of people were dismayed later when they found that the Council had decided to start a sanitary depot and that would be somewhere around where the bypass and Warrawong reaches the old Lake Road. And that was the first one, later to be extended further south and catch not only the northern end, but catch the

22:24

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breeding ground for the water bird, but also to catch the, the next one on the southern end. And then later on of course to be taken down there to where I tell you about all these birds, these parakeets and all, to start another one up down there. And the whole lot of it to me it was deplorable. breeding ground for the water bird, but also to catch the, the next one on the southern end. And then later on of course to be taken down there to where I tell you about all these birds, these parakeets and all, to start another one up down there. And the whole lot of it to me it was deplorable.

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It destroyed a lot of the natural goodness of the place I think. There was one other large swamp, the one at, at Primbee behind Koorangulla Crescent that I didn't mention. And it was also another haunt for birds and we used to find many, many ducks and red bills and coot used to inhabit this big swamp, still, still there. But what I'd like to mention about it is that late in the afternoon It destroyed a lot of the natural goodness of the place I think. There was one other large swamp, the one at, at Primbee behind Koorangulla Crescent that I didn't mention. And it was also another haunt for birds and we used to find many, many ducks and red bills and coot used to inhabit this big swamp, still, still there. But what I'd like to mention about it is that late in the afternoon

23:14

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with walking around the edge of it, I used to notice great freshwater Mullet flying up out of the water there in this swamp, so isolated from the lake. We found they'd been there for many years these fish. But big fish, fish to two or three pounds weight with walking around the edge of it, I used to notice great freshwater Mullet flying up out of the water there in this swamp, so isolated from the lake. We found they'd been there for many years these fish. But big fish, fish to two or three pounds weight

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would jump out of the water towards sundown. But once again of course they're only a dream now because, ah, it's all been finished. would jump out of the water towards sundown. But once again of course they're only a dream now because, ah, it's all been finished.

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[Glenn] You were also saying something about the, ah, [Glenn] You were also saying something about the, ah,

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foreshores of the lake. [Walter] Yes. Well the foreshores to my way of thinking it they're not much like they used to be those times either. They've gradually deteriorated. I think this weed of which I spoke has been the cause of a lot of the deterioration. Where we used to, ah, after leaving the shore, anywhere along the eastern shore of the lake we could walk out beyond the weed after going out a few chain. foreshores of the lake. [Walter] Yes. Well the foreshores to my way of thinking it they're not much like they used to be those times either. They've gradually deteriorated. I think this weed of which I spoke has been the cause of a lot of the deterioration. Where we used to, ah, after leaving the shore, anywhere along the eastern shore of the lake we could walk out beyond the weed after going out a few chain.

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Whereas now it would be necessary to walk probably 3/4 of a mile till the end of the weed Whereas now it would be necessary to walk probably 3/4 of a mile till the end of the weed

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if you needed to do any prawning or anything like that. if you needed to do any prawning or anything like that.

24:27

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And this weed that we speak of all the time to me it's the end of a good thing when it comes in this weed. Lots of people seem to think that it's necessary for breeding purposes, for fish and the like, but I beg to differ on that one. I'm not an authority on it, but I do think that it's mainly pest, this weed, and that fish don't really breed. I think that And this weed that we speak of all the time to me it's the end of a good thing when it comes in this weed. Lots of people seem to think that it's necessary for breeding purposes, for fish and the like, but I beg to differ on that one. I'm not an authority on it, but I do think that it's mainly pest, this weed, and that fish don't really breed. I think that

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for years lots of people thought that for years lots of people thought that

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prawns spread in this weed you know. prawns spread in this weed you know.

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And I think it's been proven beyond doubt that they don't. They might use it a little for shelter, but it's not, I don't think it's even necessary for that, because the prawn at very, very early age And I think it's been proven beyond doubt that they don't. They might use it a little for shelter, but it's not, I don't think it's even necessary for that, because the prawn at very, very early age

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realise that he's got the best cover if he's on the sandy bottom and he's just buried in, that's right. But, ah, I think this weed is just pest and I think that has been proven too by the fact that, ah, there was a time when they thought of destroying the black shag and cormorant that inhabit the, ah, the lakes and estuaries realise that he's got the best cover if he's on the sandy bottom and he's just buried in, that's right. But, ah, I think this weed is just pest and I think that has been proven too by the fact that, ah, there was a time when they thought of destroying the black shag and cormorant that inhabit the, ah, the lakes and estuaries

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because they thought that he was, ah, destroying lots of edible fish. But I believe that, ah, because they thought that he was, ah, destroying lots of edible fish. But I believe that, ah,

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after some investigation, after some investigation,

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pretty intensive too I think, that they found that he was pulled mainly, pretty intensive too I think, that they found that he was pulled mainly,

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yes, well I think that, ah, on investigation I have read that, ah, the black shag and fishing through this weed, this pest weed that I talk of, that all he got from it was small Eels and Fortescue. And I don't really believe it's of any value at all this weed in the breeding and production of fishes. And I think that the yes, well I think that, ah, on investigation I have read that, ah, the black shag and fishing through this weed, this pest weed that I talk of, that all he got from it was small Eels and Fortescue. And I don't really believe it's of any value at all this weed in the breeding and production of fishes. And I think that the

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Mullet and even the small Blackfish and stuff they, they breed in places where there's none of this weed. And I've taken notice of other lakes where this weed doesn't grow, like Lake Conjola and those places, and we find that there's an abundance of all types of fish there that get by and seem to breed there without this pest weed that we speak of that clogs up all our waterways. Mullet and even the small Blackfish and stuff they, they breed in places where there's none of this weed. And I've taken notice of other lakes where this weed doesn't grow, like Lake Conjola and those places, and we find that there's an abundance of all types of fish there that get by and seem to breed there without this pest weed that we speak of that clogs up all our waterways.

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[Glenn] There's a lot of, ah, talk nowadays of, of, ah, lead going, going into the lake from somewhere over there. Do you know anything about it or not? [Walter] Which direction would that be? [Glenn] I, I don't know which direction it goes in, but there's some people were telling me the other day who used to, who fly over the lake and they see this red discharge in there and they suspect it's coming from somewhere in the industry at Port Kembla or somewhere like that. [Walter] Oh, I'm afraid I'm not acquainted with that Glenn. I'd like to be able to give you something [Glenn] There's a lot of, ah, talk nowadays of, of, ah, lead going, going into the lake from somewhere over there. Do you know anything about it or not? [Walter] Which direction would that be? [Glenn] I, I don't know which direction it goes in, but there's some people were telling me the other day who used to, who fly over the lake and they see this red discharge in there and they suspect it's coming from somewhere in the industry at Port Kembla or somewhere like that. [Walter] Oh, I'm afraid I'm not acquainted with that Glenn. I'd like to be able to give you something

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on that, but I'm afraid that I couldn't. Strangely enough, I've not been around the lake for the last few years since I no longer have a boat I don't go around the lake like I used to. Because, ah, for the first time in my life I find myself without about a boat. And of course, once again we get back on the weed business [laughs] we find that it's necessary to have a boat if you want to fish the lake, because this weed has taken over on that, but I'm afraid that I couldn't. Strangely enough, I've not been around the lake for the last few years since I no longer have a boat I don't go around the lake like I used to. Because, ah, for the first time in my life I find myself without about a boat. And of course, once again we get back on the weed business [laughs] we find that it's necessary to have a boat if you want to fish the lake, because this weed has taken over

27:43

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and has pushed us off the shores until we must have a boat to get out beyond it. And I do believe that this weed has created as some kind of, some kind of, ah, pollution of the water that finds its way along the shores and along the bypass. Not so much in the tidal portion of it, but any of the backwaters soon become clogged with it and become useless in more, in more ways than one I feel sure. and has pushed us off the shores until we must have a boat to get out beyond it. And I do believe that this weed has created as some kind of, some kind of, ah, pollution of the water that finds its way along the shores and along the bypass. Not so much in the tidal portion of it, but any of the backwaters soon become clogged with it and become useless in more, in more ways than one I feel sure.

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[Glenn] Did many of your friends used to go fishing with you on the boat? [Walter] Yes, I've been out there I think with nearly all of my friends at different times, quite a number of them anyway, and many, many good days we've had there. Of course, with the lake being so prolific a few years back, and not so many years back, but it's gradually got, I think [Glenn] Did many of your friends used to go fishing with you on the boat? [Walter] Yes, I've been out there I think with nearly all of my friends at different times, quite a number of them anyway, and many, many good days we've had there. Of course, with the lake being so prolific a few years back, and not so many years back, but it's gradually got, I think

28:39

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slowly got worse and it's harder to get fish now than before. slowly got worse and it's harder to get fish now than before.

28:43

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But in those good old days when we used to go out there when the water was clean and But in those good old days when we used to go out there when the water was clean and

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clear there were so many fish there that, ah, one could not help but talk about them to your friends. And the inevitable thing to do was of course, was to go out amongst them and take your friends with you when you went. And I don't remember any occasion I went out there without a good day being had and a very successful day amongst the fish. Of course prawns could, green prawns for bait, could be bought those times for, oh, round about one and sixpence a pound (1/6) clear there were so many fish there that, ah, one could not help but talk about them to your friends. And the inevitable thing to do was of course, was to go out amongst them and take your friends with you when you went. And I don't remember any occasion I went out there without a good day being had and a very successful day amongst the fish. Of course prawns could, green prawns for bait, could be bought those times for, oh, round about one and sixpence a pound (1/6)

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according to who you bought them from, and 'a pound' meant a pint measure. according to who you bought them from, and 'a pound' meant a pint measure.

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That's the type of, ah, of people we used to find when we needed bait to go out there. And to save us a few bob we'd go out there with an abundance of bait and have no trouble to use them either. All down the channels Flathead were in abundance from this crown head I speak of at the Yacht Club right away down to the entrance where the islands are we used to find fish all the way. It was not necessary to have landmarks anywhere out round That's the type of, ah, of people we used to find when we needed bait to go out there. And to save us a few bob we'd go out there with an abundance of bait and have no trouble to use them either. All down the channels Flathead were in abundance from this crown head I speak of at the Yacht Club right away down to the entrance where the islands are we used to find fish all the way. It was not necessary to have landmarks anywhere out round

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say at a paddle depth from the shore towards the channel. We'd go into the shallows and then go out and until we struck about a paddle depth of water and anchor there on nice, clean bottom and almost immediately commence catching fish, almost immediately and, ah, say at a paddle depth from the shore towards the channel. We'd go into the shallows and then go out and until we struck about a paddle depth of water and anchor there on nice, clean bottom and almost immediately commence catching fish, almost immediately and, ah,

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oh, we've had so many days. I remember one day I went out there I took two small boys with me and, ah, we caught so many fish oh, we've had so many days. I remember one day I went out there I took two small boys with me and, ah, we caught so many fish

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the two little boys probably caught as many as I did too, I don't know. the two little boys probably caught as many as I did too, I don't know.

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But we struck But we struck

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a great patch of a great patch of

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sizeable sizeable

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Red fish, Red fish,

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sizeable Bream, sizeable Bream,

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Flathead, Flathead,

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Whiting. And then we found a school of Tailor came along and they were big Tailor too, Tailor something round about two feet in length. And what a day we had, an afternoon we had, amongst them there. But for bait we had prawns and we also had some little Silverbiddy that the fishermen had hauled in just before we left the shore, so we'd taken about a bucket full of them along with us too. We had about four pounds of Whiting. And then we found a school of Tailor came along and they were big Tailor too, Tailor something round about two feet in length. And what a day we had, an afternoon we had, amongst them there. But for bait we had prawns and we also had some little Silverbiddy that the fishermen had hauled in just before we left the shore, so we'd taken about a bucket full of them along with us too. We had about four pounds of

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prawns and the Silverbiddys. And I remember we knocked off when we ran out of bait [laughs] and ?? all these big fish. We had so many fish in the boat that we wondered how we were going to carry them home from the prawns and the Silverbiddys. And I remember we knocked off when we ran out of bait [laughs] and ?? all these big fish. We had so many fish in the boat that we wondered how we were going to carry them home from the

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lake shore up to where we lived. By then we was living in Hassan Street and luckily a brother of mine came along at the right time. He hired a boat, came out to where we were and later seeing the plight we were in. He was able to take the fish from us and by putting them in several bags he put them in the sidecar of his motorbike and we were able to get the fish home otherwise we would not have been able to carry them to shore. And that's not a fish story, that's a true one. lake shore up to where we lived. By then we was living in Hassan Street and luckily a brother of mine came along at the right time. He hired a boat, came out to where we were and later seeing the plight we were in. He was able to take the fish from us and by putting them in several bags he put them in the sidecar of his motorbike and we were able to get the fish home otherwise we would not have been able to carry them to shore. And that's not a fish story, that's a true one.

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And, ah, And, ah,

31:59

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one of the little boys that was with me at the time, unfortunately he was the same little fellow that one of the little boys that was with me at the time, unfortunately he was the same little fellow that

32:06

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met his death on the met his death on the

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face of No. 4 Jetty. He was aloft doing some electrical repair, repair and his steel plate contacted a live wire carrying about 33,000 volts. Little Billy Coombs was the name of the little fellow I speak of. And he was one of the little boys I had out there that day with me. But there was certainly some good fishing to be had and, ah, it was really a fishermen's paradise in more ways than one. face of No. 4 Jetty. He was aloft doing some electrical repair, repair and his steel plate contacted a live wire carrying about 33,000 volts. Little Billy Coombs was the name of the little fellow I speak of. And he was one of the little boys I had out there that day with me. But there was certainly some good fishing to be had and, ah, it was really a fishermen's paradise in more ways than one.

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[Glenn] Did you ever fish the other side of the lake? [Walter] Yes, we've fished the other side but, ah, it was not as accessible with what it is today since there was go back, I'm going back now a lot of years and, ah, [Glenn] Did you ever fish the other side of the lake? [Walter] Yes, we've fished the other side but, ah, it was not as accessible with what it is today since there was go back, I'm going back now a lot of years and, ah,

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because of the absence of the, ah, marine motor, most of the fishermen they had to rely on row boats. Yes, that's right. And I myself used to row right across the other side. Sometimes when I'd go with fishermen, if we found southerlys blowing, we found it necessary to be on the sheltered shore and it would mean a row across to Albion Park side to do the fishing and then come back on bad nights. But, ah, of course we used to allow for because of the absence of the, ah, marine motor, most of the fishermen they had to rely on row boats. Yes, that's right. And I myself used to row right across the other side. Sometimes when I'd go with fishermen, if we found southerlys blowing, we found it necessary to be on the sheltered shore and it would mean a row across to Albion Park side to do the fishing and then come back on bad nights. But, ah, of course we used to allow for

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that and make an early start in the afternoon to row over there. And we were always pretty assured of a good wind, a favourable wind to come back with from over there. [Glenn] How long would it take you to row? [Walter] Well, I really ought to know but I don't really know because I went so many times and even after, in later years when I lived at Hassan Street, and my boys were growing up, this would be around about, oh, the period of the, ah, that and make an early start in the afternoon to row over there. And we were always pretty assured of a good wind, a favourable wind to come back with from over there. [Glenn] How long would it take you to row? [Walter] Well, I really ought to know but I don't really know because I went so many times and even after, in later years when I lived at Hassan Street, and my boys were growing up, this would be around about, oh, the period of the, ah,

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the last World War, something round in the 1940 early 1940s we used to go across pretty regularly. This was before the Tallawarra powerhouse and rabbits were the main reason for us going over there. We used to take the ferrets over there and the nets. But to row across there, we never used to think anything of it. It's all right to say, oh, you had your boys with you to help you, but I used to go on my own and I used to row almost nonstop the last World War, something round in the 1940 early 1940s we used to go across pretty regularly. This was before the Tallawarra powerhouse and rabbits were the main reason for us going over there. We used to take the ferrets over there and the nets. But to row across there, we never used to think anything of it. It's all right to say, oh, you had your boys with you to help you, but I used to go on my own and I used to row almost nonstop

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from from

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Northcliffe drive, the shore at Northcliffe drive, right across to Tallawarra and I'd go almost nonstop with the oars across there. And I think that maybe an hour and a half or two hours I would say something like it would take to go over in fair weather. But of course when you're going abroad like that or getting away from the shores, well, you don't always find favourable weather and I used to find some tough ?? and get over there to find a heavy northeast would come up and Northcliffe drive, the shore at Northcliffe drive, right across to Tallawarra and I'd go almost nonstop with the oars across there. And I think that maybe an hour and a half or two hours I would say something like it would take to go over in fair weather. But of course when you're going abroad like that or getting away from the shores, well, you don't always find favourable weather and I used to find some tough ?? and get over there to find a heavy northeast would come up and

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we'd have to come back against it, pull back against it. But, ah, and consequently I didn't do much fishing over that side in the early days because it meant too much work and there was so much fish to be had round this northern end. we'd have to come back against it, pull back against it. But, ah, and consequently I didn't do much fishing over that side in the early days because it meant too much work and there was so much fish to be had round this northern end.

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And we were always living in the northern end and we always fished on the northern end. And later when I got launches of my own and I found that I was able to go across the southern end and fish around the reef, Native Dog as it was known in those days, now Mount Warrigal, with not the sign of a house in sight there. And there was always lots of good fish to be caught around the reef that stands out in front of Mount Warrigal and the islands before it become weeded up with that stinking weed that And we were always living in the northern end and we always fished on the northern end. And later when I got launches of my own and I found that I was able to go across the southern end and fish around the reef, Native Dog as it was known in those days, now Mount Warrigal, with not the sign of a house in sight there. And there was always lots of good fish to be caught around the reef that stands out in front of Mount Warrigal and the islands before it become weeded up with that stinking weed that

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I talk about on the back channels [laughs]. I talk about on the back channels [laughs].

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[Glenn] And what of bird life over that area? [Walter] There was lots of it. I think there's always been lots of bird life. There's always been lots of swans and lots of ducks. But going back all those years I think that there was more then, even more than what there is now. There's quite a lot of bird life now in the lake. I think the, ah, [Glenn] And what of bird life over that area? [Walter] There was lots of it. I think there's always been lots of bird life. There's always been lots of swans and lots of ducks. But going back all those years I think that there was more then, even more than what there is now. There's quite a lot of bird life now in the lake. I think the, ah,

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the fact that they're protected the fact that they're protected

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and they seem somehow to sense it, their security. and they seem somehow to sense it, their security.

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And they, ah, they pile into these places, these sanctuaries, I think, And they, ah, they pile into these places, these sanctuaries, I think,

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luckily, and where they know that they won't be molested. luckily, and where they know that they won't be molested.

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But even those days But even those days

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it was not unusual to see great flocks of ducks in the hundreds on most of the shores of the lake. And of course swans, there was always swans, pelicans, and the old black shag, plenty of them too. it was not unusual to see great flocks of ducks in the hundreds on most of the shores of the lake. And of course swans, there was always swans, pelicans, and the old black shag, plenty of them too.

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Occasional musk duck and Occasional musk duck and

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widgeons, as we knew them. There was lots of birds on the lake, apart from the egrets on the shore and the cranes. Some of the big white crested sea eagles, we used to see them too. I think they used to nest on Gooseberry Island, I think. But there was lots of birds and bird life, waterfowl of all sorts. widgeons, as we knew them. There was lots of birds on the lake, apart from the egrets on the shore and the cranes. Some of the big white crested sea eagles, we used to see them too. I think they used to nest on Gooseberry Island, I think. But there was lots of birds and bird life, waterfowl of all sorts.

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[Glenn] You were saying before about this small area of grass where the prawns used to be laid out on, um, you know, you'd cook them and salt them, spread them and salt them and cool them and eat them. Where was, where was that? [Walter] Well, that was pretty near to where the bypass from Warrawong reaches the Old Lake Road, Shellharbour Road, that is the area. There was a number of oak trees growing there at the time. [Glenn] You were saying before about this small area of grass where the prawns used to be laid out on, um, you know, you'd cook them and salt them, spread them and salt them and cool them and eat them. Where was, where was that? [Walter] Well, that was pretty near to where the bypass from Warrawong reaches the Old Lake Road, Shellharbour Road, that is the area. There was a number of oak trees growing there at the time.

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I'm not sure now whether or not there is oak trees there. Later on a house were built there, I'm not sure now whether or not there is oak trees there. Later on a house were built there,

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built there by Mr. Jimmy Hooper I think. He was a gentleman who had a, a store down at the mouth of the lake, after the mouth of the lake, built there by Mr. Jimmy Hooper I think. He was a gentleman who had a, a store down at the mouth of the lake, after the mouth of the lake,

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after the bridge had been erected across the lake. But, ah, that is the area and it was a ideal spot, a really an ideal spot. But I think that, ah, buffalo stretched from around about that area right along the shore of the lake to where the old freezer used to be. after the bridge had been erected across the lake. But, ah, that is the area and it was a ideal spot, a really an ideal spot. But I think that, ah, buffalo stretched from around about that area right along the shore of the lake to where the old freezer used to be.

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And I think that takes us around to almost at Davies Point, maybe right onto Davies point it was all couch or buffalo grass all the way around there. [Glenn] Starting off round about where the tank trap... [Walter] Starting off round about there, roundabout there. The tank trap is what I should have said in the first place as being the most obvious landmark, yes. And that is the spot around about the tank trap a little further south if anything and from where the oak trees used to stand And I think that takes us around to almost at Davies Point, maybe right onto Davies point it was all couch or buffalo grass all the way around there. [Glenn] Starting off round about where the tank trap... [Walter] Starting off round about there, roundabout there. The tank trap is what I should have said in the first place as being the most obvious landmark, yes. And that is the spot around about the tank trap a little further south if anything and from where the oak trees used to stand

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and give us shade in the day time on this beautiful green grass and it must have resembled a nice lawn and to where they used to spread their prawns to cool off. And what a beautiful clean place it was. I have in my mind just how nice it really was and what a joy it was to be there when they were all cooked [laughs] and cooling off. and give us shade in the day time on this beautiful green grass and it must have resembled a nice lawn and to where they used to spread their prawns to cool off. And what a beautiful clean place it was. I have in my mind just how nice it really was and what a joy it was to be there when they were all cooked [laughs] and cooling off.

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Unfortunately, all the poor old fellows that used to be there to enjoy them are no longer with us. And I can't tell you how much I'd like to be able to get in conversation with them again to have them here with me this very minute so that we could talk it over and discuss it as I am with you, because they were really something in my life. I was always a bit nature minded like that I think and I used to love to do those kind of things. As I say the walk down to the entrance, Unfortunately, all the poor old fellows that used to be there to enjoy them are no longer with us. And I can't tell you how much I'd like to be able to get in conversation with them again to have them here with me this very minute so that we could talk it over and discuss it as I am with you, because they were really something in my life. I was always a bit nature minded like that I think and I used to love to do those kind of things. As I say the walk down to the entrance,

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it wouldn't appeal to a lot of people maybe, it wouldn't appeal to a lot of people maybe,

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but to me it always did. [Glenn] Did many people from Port Kembla use the lake? [Walter] No, I would say not. It would not be unusual to see nobody but to me it always did. [Glenn] Did many people from Port Kembla use the lake? [Walter] No, I would say not. It would not be unusual to see nobody

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on reaching the entrance. Many, many times I've been down there with them, have not seen a soul at all except the party that we'd be in, or sometimes I'd be on my own. on reaching the entrance. Many, many times I've been down there with them, have not seen a soul at all except the party that we'd be in, or sometimes I'd be on my own.

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Excuse me, but, ah, of course it was really Excuse me, but, ah, of course it was really

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the dead end. It was, ah, the dead end. It was, ah,

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a place where no one would have any business unless they, I think, unless they wanted to fish. The, ah, the road was only a, a semblance of a road, a sand, a heavy sand track down through the bush a place where no one would have any business unless they, I think, unless they wanted to fish. The, ah, the road was only a, a semblance of a road, a sand, a heavy sand track down through the bush

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most of the way. most of the way.

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And, ah, And, ah,

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the kind of track that had been made by horseback or probably an occasional sulky would be driven down there. But people realised that there was nothing at the end of the road, only the, the entrance itself, and unless you were a fisherman, the kind of track that had been made by horseback or probably an occasional sulky would be driven down there. But people realised that there was nothing at the end of the road, only the, the entrance itself, and unless you were a fisherman,

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well, then what else. well, then what else.

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There was no There was no

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habitation, there was no store, there was no anything. [Glenn] And if you lived in Port Kembla and you wanted to go fishing, you could always just habitation, there was no store, there was no anything. [Glenn] And if you lived in Port Kembla and you wanted to go fishing, you could always just

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slip over the harbour slip over the harbour

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anyway. [Walter] Or over to the islands [laughs]. [Glenn] Yes. [Walter] Indeed, yes. [Glenn] Bit closer. [Walter] Yes, of course you could too and, ah, anyway. [Walter] Or over to the islands [laughs]. [Glenn] Yes. [Walter] Indeed, yes. [Glenn] Bit closer. [Walter] Yes, of course you could too and, ah,

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so many people used to avail themselves of the opportunity to get to the islands, as I did myself. Because we found that we could hire a boat at any time. There was, ah, as I think I said before in another interview with you that boats were always available at the boat harbour in Port Kembla and, ah, for a fee of something like about four shillings at the time you could take a boat out for a ½ day from dinner time until whatever time it suited you so many people used to avail themselves of the opportunity to get to the islands, as I did myself. Because we found that we could hire a boat at any time. There was, ah, as I think I said before in another interview with you that boats were always available at the boat harbour in Port Kembla and, ah, for a fee of something like about four shillings at the time you could take a boat out for a ½ day from dinner time until whatever time it suited you

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to come in. [Glenn] Yes. [Walter] And the same applied at Perkins Beach, we called it Fishermans Beach, to come in. [Glenn] Yes. [Walter] And the same applied at Perkins Beach, we called it Fishermans Beach,

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on the way over to, ah, we found it necessary to get a boat to get across to the other islands, ah, Rabbit Island or what they call the third island, the gap island that stands out behind Rabbit Island. And, ah, for something like about four shillings we could take the boat. Well, you can imagine with two or three persons applying for ??? there's really nothing, these prawns being so cheap and all that, it wasn't, it wasn't unusual to take over three parts of a kerosene tin full of prawns on the way over to, ah, we found it necessary to get a boat to get across to the other islands, ah, Rabbit Island or what they call the third island, the gap island that stands out behind Rabbit Island. And, ah, for something like about four shillings we could take the boat. Well, you can imagine with two or three persons applying for ??? there's really nothing, these prawns being so cheap and all that, it wasn't, it wasn't unusual to take over three parts of a kerosene tin full of prawns

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?? with us ?? with us

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By golly there were lots of fish to be caught. As I mentioned before about all the fish that we used to catch there. And I think I forgot to mention about all the big Snapper and the big Groper which I didn't mention. I'm sure I didn't, that were taken from over. There was many, many times I went there and caught big, big Snapper and big Groper I think the biggest Groper I got over there would have weighed something round about 60 pounds, Blue Groper. By golly there were lots of fish to be caught. As I mentioned before about all the fish that we used to catch there. And I think I forgot to mention about all the big Snapper and the big Groper which I didn't mention. I'm sure I didn't, that were taken from over. There was many, many times I went there and caught big, big Snapper and big Groper I think the biggest Groper I got over there would have weighed something round about 60 pounds, Blue Groper.

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I remember I remember

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that I, ah, I had this particular Groper and another one probably about 25 pounds when I came in, in the afternoon, after catching him, or catching the two of them. And the fisherman had made a haul of fish on the little beach there from where we'd taken the boat in the earlier part of the day and they had their gear ready. What they used to do those times was to have a little sledge, that I, ah, I had this particular Groper and another one probably about 25 pounds when I came in, in the afternoon, after catching him, or catching the two of them. And the fisherman had made a haul of fish on the little beach there from where we'd taken the boat in the earlier part of the day and they had their gear ready. What they used to do those times was to have a little sledge,

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a little slide, sledge I think you might call it, fastened to the end of a rope. a little slide, sledge I think you might call it, fastened to the end of a rope.

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A lorry up on the grass right above the sand hill and they'd lowered their fish into the, on to this little sledge and the lorry would drive across the grass and haul this little sledge up for this load of boxed fish from down on the beach. That was the method they used to use rather than carry them up this big soft sand hill bank, they'd have a lorry to, to pull from the top to the little sledge below. A lorry up on the grass right above the sand hill and they'd lowered their fish into the, on to this little sledge and the lorry would drive across the grass and haul this little sledge up for this load of boxed fish from down on the beach. That was the method they used to use rather than carry them up this big soft sand hill bank, they'd have a lorry to, to pull from the top to the little sledge below.

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They'd box their fish and put them on the sledge and haul them up. They'd box their fish and put them on the sledge and haul them up.

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And, ah, to get back to what I was saying, I just came in, in the midst of it, so I was able to put my two fish on the, on the sledge and haul them up. And I was glad too because they were, it would have been too big a load for me. And, ah, to get back to what I was saying, I just came in, in the midst of it, so I was able to put my two fish on the, on the sledge and haul them up. And I was glad too because they were, it would have been too big a load for me.

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But, ah, we got many, many big hauls of big Groper like that. Blue Groper could be caught all around the island and so could Snapper. [Glenn] Just two final questions. When you were out on the island and you looked back towards Port Kembla, what could you see? [Walter] Well, a lot depends on how far we go back, because if we go back far enough, oh, of course I wouldn't have gone out there until I was in my teens I think. As a child I don't remember ever being But, ah, we got many, many big hauls of big Groper like that. Blue Groper could be caught all around the island and so could Snapper. [Glenn] Just two final questions. When you were out on the island and you looked back towards Port Kembla, what could you see? [Walter] Well, a lot depends on how far we go back, because if we go back far enough, oh, of course I wouldn't have gone out there until I was in my teens I think. As a child I don't remember ever being

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on the island, But, ah, in my teens, oh, little could be seen. There was not a great deal of people living here at the time. on the island, But, ah, in my teens, oh, little could be seen. There was not a great deal of people living here at the time.

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And, ah, And, ah,

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I was mostly down around the location of the old surf beach those times. And, ah, there was really nothing there then. I was mostly down around the location of the old surf beach those times. And, ah, there was really nothing there then.

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All you could see was the, the MM, Metal Manufacturers and the E.R.&S in the way of industry and a couple of stacks. I think the E.R.&S., old E.R.&S. stack and then the partly constructed stack that stood on the eastern side of that E.R.& S stack. But they were about all the landmarks we had. We used to use them to advantage outside too by lining them up with certain parts of the mountain All you could see was the, the MM, Metal Manufacturers and the E.R.&S in the way of industry and a couple of stacks. I think the E.R.&S., old E.R.&S. stack and then the partly constructed stack that stood on the eastern side of that E.R.& S stack. But they were about all the landmarks we had. We used to use them to advantage outside too by lining them up with certain parts of the mountain

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or we'd find something even higher up and line these stacks or we'd find something even higher up and line these stacks

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and which used to enable us, by taking a north and south and which used to enable us, by taking a north and south

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bearing and an east and west bearing, we'd find ourselves able to go almost pinpoint the spot from whence we - it was necessary because the reefs are isolated bearing and an east and west bearing, we'd find ourselves able to go almost pinpoint the spot from whence we - it was necessary because the reefs are isolated

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out there and we'd find lots of sand patches with isolated reefs. And if you caught fish today, you'd really want to know where to go back and be able to pinpoint the spot for tomorrow, so... out there and we'd find lots of sand patches with isolated reefs. And if you caught fish today, you'd really want to know where to go back and be able to pinpoint the spot for tomorrow, so...

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[Glenn] And what could you see later on, [Glenn] And what could you see later on,

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as, ah, as time went on? [Walter] Well, I saw lots of, lots of houses coming along and, ah, civilisation was on its way. Of course you don't see such a great lot from outside there, not such a great lot, because if you go any distance at sea well you finish up being only able to see the foreshore or the, the the coastline really. And there's really nothing much to talk about, as, ah, as time went on? [Walter] Well, I saw lots of, lots of houses coming along and, ah, civilisation was on its way. Of course you don't see such a great lot from outside there, not such a great lot, because if you go any distance at sea well you finish up being only able to see the foreshore or the, the the coastline really. And there's really nothing much to talk about,

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I don't think then, that I can remember really, that I can remember. But of course houses spread I don't think then, that I can remember really, that I can remember. But of course houses spread

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and places that used to be bare we found were populated. But to really appreciate the growth, one had to be ashore I think, and places that used to be bare we found were populated. But to really appreciate the growth, one had to be ashore I think,

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to walk around amongst it. to walk around amongst it.

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And I found, ah, places where we used to be able to saunter across or go in a straight line and direction wherever we were going, it was no longer on because there was, ah, And I found, ah, places where we used to be able to saunter across or go in a straight line and direction wherever we were going, it was no longer on because there was, ah,

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gradually all the blocks become sold and built on, all the streets and terraces and avenues. [Glenn] Just a final question. gradually all the blocks become sold and built on, all the streets and terraces and avenues. [Glenn] Just a final question.

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Did you ever have a variation in smell while you're working on the wharf? [Walter] Yes, indeed I did. Of course a lot used to depend on the wind, but Did you ever have a variation in smell while you're working on the wharf? [Walter] Yes, indeed I did. Of course a lot used to depend on the wind, but

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I think that everyone who worked there would know that there were times when it was almost unbearable. In fact, it was unbearable at times and men had to knock off, I've been there when we've had to knock off with the stench and the discomfort of fumes coming from the E.R.&S. stacks and in that direction. Of course, it's not for me to say the exact source of those pollutions, but we do know I think that everyone who worked there would know that there were times when it was almost unbearable. In fact, it was unbearable at times and men had to knock off, I've been there when we've had to knock off with the stench and the discomfort of fumes coming from the E.R.&S. stacks and in that direction. Of course, it's not for me to say the exact source of those pollutions, but we do know

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that there was times when it used to come down there with such a bad smell. I think on those occasions it had a, a yellow sulfury look about it, but it had a real toilet smell, if you understand what I mean, that there was times when it used to come down there with such a bad smell. I think on those occasions it had a, a yellow sulfury look about it, but it had a real toilet smell, if you understand what I mean,

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and it used to be so very, very bad and was uncomfortable. But the one that used to cause us the most trouble and it used to be so very, very bad and was uncomfortable. But the one that used to cause us the most trouble

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was the acidy one that used to come down there. We'd see it in the form of a greyish blue, blue or bluish grey kind of smog that used to come down there. A fume we used to call it, we used to call it fumes. But I've seen it so bad that one could scarcely breathe and there was no need to exaggerate about the bad condition of it because we used to find men with coughing fits that were uncontrollable. was the acidy one that used to come down there. We'd see it in the form of a greyish blue, blue or bluish grey kind of smog that used to come down there. A fume we used to call it, we used to call it fumes. But I've seen it so bad that one could scarcely breathe and there was no need to exaggerate about the bad condition of it because we used to find men with coughing fits that were uncontrollable.

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I used to work with them on the trucks and this stuff would get into your nose and throat. And I've seen it so bad it was only with difficulty you could see I used to work with them on the trucks and this stuff would get into your nose and throat. And I've seen it so bad it was only with difficulty you could see

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the end of the wharf whilst working in the middle, particularly No. 4. I think that the sou-west winds used to carry it down straight on to No. 4 jetty and I think from number 3 Jetty I think the southerlies used to bring it down. Now I'm not too sure of the points exactly from which the wind used to blow, but it was always a south or a southerly or sou-west wind that brought them down and they were indeed very, very bad. Not only did they affect the men the end of the wharf whilst working in the middle, particularly No. 4. I think that the sou-west winds used to carry it down straight on to No. 4 jetty and I think from number 3 Jetty I think the southerlies used to bring it down. Now I'm not too sure of the points exactly from which the wind used to blow, but it was always a south or a southerly or sou-west wind that brought them down and they were indeed very, very bad. Not only did they affect the men

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on the wharfs and on there working on the wharves and working on the trucks, but they also used to come down the hatch to where we were too and we could see it in the sunlight, a bluish vapour down there. And we could also taste and smell it too. Very, very objectionable, on the wharfs and on there working on the wharves and working on the trucks, but they also used to come down the hatch to where we were too and we could see it in the sunlight, a bluish vapour down there. And we could also taste and smell it too. Very, very objectionable,

50:16

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with a, a burning kind of sensation that, ah, wanted to tickle your throat with a, a burning kind of sensation that, ah, wanted to tickle your throat

50:22

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and cause you to cough all the time and a feeling that, and cause you to cough all the time and a feeling that,

50:25

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of breathlessness of breathlessness

50:28

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being inhaled. being inhaled.

50:31

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But there was times when I've had to knock off myself and I know there's been many, many times that I haven't been on that particular wharf that men have gone home too from the effects of the fumes there. And even if they haven't been discharged, at least they'd have to knock off until it seemed to improve a little, you know, maybe a little change of the wind or something like that. But there was times when I've had to knock off myself and I know there's been many, many times that I haven't been on that particular wharf that men have gone home too from the effects of the fumes there. And even if they haven't been discharged, at least they'd have to knock off until it seemed to improve a little, you know, maybe a little change of the wind or something like that.

50:54

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But it was very, very bad. But it was very, very bad.

50:57

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I think it was because of the pressure I think it was because of the pressure

50:60

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on the Waterside Workers Federation on the Waterside Workers Federation

51:03

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had a lot to do with the construction eventually of the had a lot to do with the construction eventually of the

51:07

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taller stack at Port Kembla. I think that, ah, taller stack at Port Kembla. I think that, ah,

51:11

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they felt that something had to be done. I know that, ah, there were lots of complaints from people living adjacent to the E.R.&S. they felt that something had to be done. I know that, ah, there were lots of complaints from people living adjacent to the E.R.&S.

51:21

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They complained that they They complained that they

51:24

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couldn't successfully grow anything in their gardens. couldn't successfully grow anything in their gardens.

51:28

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That, ah, That, ah,

51:29

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shrubs and vegetables shrubs and vegetables

51:31

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alike were all affected by the fumes. alike were all affected by the fumes.

51:35

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And, ah, people living around there And, ah, people living around there

51:38

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affected, they had their health affected too, and continually complained about it. And I think that, ah, the pressure from those people and the pressure from the Waterside Workers in particular, I think is what might have been the deciding factor in the construction of that affected, they had their health affected too, and continually complained about it. And I think that, ah, the pressure from those people and the pressure from the Waterside Workers in particular, I think is what might have been the deciding factor in the construction of that

51:54

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taller stack existing ? taller stack existing ?

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