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There we go. We're recording now now this is Ingrid Grace, local studies librarian at the Waverley Library conducting an oral history interview to coincide with International Women's Day 2020. Celebrating the 100 Years of Women project in local government. It is to record some moments, key moments in the history of women in local government in Waverley and their role in these events to gain insight into the challenges and role of women elected to local government. Their experiences, learnings, There we go. We're recording now now this is Ingrid Grace, local studies librarian at the Waverley Library conducting an oral history interview to coincide with International Women's Day 2020. Celebrating the 100 Years of Women project in local government. It is to record some moments, key moments in the history of women in local government in Waverley and their role in these events to gain insight into the challenges and role of women elected to local government. Their experiences, learnings,
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leadership and empowerment. This interview for Women in Local Government oral history project leadership and empowerment. This interview for Women in Local Government oral history project
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is with uh, Joy Clayton. It is Friday the 28th August 2020. is with uh, Joy Clayton. It is Friday the 28th August 2020.
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Thank you for agreeing to do this with me. Thank you for agreeing to do this with me.
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Then first I'd like to get some biographical details. So what is your full name? [Joy] Joy Christine Clayton. [Ingrid] And when were you born? [Joy] 27th of the 11th, 1937. Then first I'd like to get some biographical details. So what is your full name? [Joy] Joy Christine Clayton. [Ingrid] And when were you born? [Joy] 27th of the 11th, 1937.
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How did your family come to live in Waverley? How did your family come to live in Waverley?
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My mother My mother
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came from England, or my grandparents came from England, came from England, or my grandparents came from England,
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and my Grandfather set up a business uh, in English worsteds supplying to the tailors and trade in Sydney. and my Grandfather set up a business uh, in English worsteds supplying to the tailors and trade in Sydney.
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And because he traveled by sea with the cargo, um, he d-when my grandmother had my mother and uncle. He decided to settle in Australia because my uncle was was born on one trip back to England and my mother was born on another trip back to Australia. So, um, And because he traveled by sea with the cargo, um, he d-when my grandmother had my mother and uncle. He decided to settle in Australia because my uncle was was born on one trip back to England and my mother was born on another trip back to Australia. So, um,
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my uncles got a British passport, but my mother was born here in Australia and so they settled in Waverley as soon as they came here and uh, my uncles got a British passport, but my mother was born here in Australia and so they settled in Waverley as soon as they came here and uh,
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and they grew up in Waverley. And my father's parents lived in Anglesea Street also, so they were Waverley res-residents as well. So I've had a connection since the 1800s of my, both my families in Waverley. [Ingrid] Goodness. and they grew up in Waverley. And my father's parents lived in Anglesea Street also, so they were Waverley res-residents as well. So I've had a connection since the 1800s of my, both my families in Waverley. [Ingrid] Goodness.
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And what was your favourite thing to do here? And what were your favourite memories of living in the area? And what was your favourite thing to do here? And what were your favourite memories of living in the area?
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Favourite memories um, oh the fact of going down to Bondi Beach with my school friends. Favourite memories um, oh the fact of going down to Bondi Beach with my school friends.
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And uh, And uh,
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Bondi Beach is the most beautiful place in the world, of all the places I've traveled. I just love being back in Bondi. We have the, the most beautiful clear sand, Bondi Beach is the most beautiful place in the world, of all the places I've traveled. I just love being back in Bondi. We have the, the most beautiful clear sand,
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and uh, and the weather is always conducive to outdoor activities, and I think that's one of the nicest things about our country. and uh, and the weather is always conducive to outdoor activities, and I think that's one of the nicest things about our country.
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It is, isn't it? It is, isn't it?
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And what school activities, sports, civic activities did you participate in, like debating? [Joy] Yes. Well, I-I liked dressmaking at Bellevue Hill School and um,  And what school activities, sports, civic activities did you participate in, like debating? [Joy] Yes. Well, I-I liked dressmaking at Bellevue Hill School and um, 
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not Bellevue Hill. It was Randwick. I did dressmaking. That's right. Bellevue Hill, I participated in uh, basketball. I was the goalie and um, not Bellevue Hill. It was Randwick. I did dressmaking. That's right. Bellevue Hill, I participated in uh, basketball. I was the goalie and um,
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what else did I do? Swimming when I went to Randwick Girls School I did the life saving certificates. Loved swimming at Wiley's Baths, would you believe? what else did I do? Swimming when I went to Randwick Girls School I did the life saving certificates. Loved swimming at Wiley's Baths, would you believe?
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Yes, that's where we did our training, yes, and I loved it. So swimming is one of my greatest sports. Yes, that's where we did our training, yes, and I loved it. So swimming is one of my greatest sports.
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And the basketball and tennis, And the basketball and tennis,
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also. We had tennis courts in, in um, also. We had tennis courts in, in um,
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Blair s- going through from Blair St in North Bondi through to Wallis Parade. Big tennis courts, so would- Tib Doherty's tennis courts. Yes, so that's where I played tennis every week. And of course I went to um, Blair s- going through from Blair St in North Bondi through to Wallis Parade. Big tennis courts, so would- Tib Doherty's tennis courts. Yes, so that's where I played tennis every week. And of course I went to um,
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in Hardy Street, I was taught to play the piano. in Hardy Street, I was taught to play the piano.
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And And
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attended the Conservatorium of Music attended the Conservatorium of Music
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in the city to get my various certificates. Yes. in the city to get my various certificates. Yes.
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[Ingrid] Good old Conservatorium. [Joy] Yes. [Ingrid] I've done the same thing. [Joy] Yes. [Ingrid] Good old Conservatorium. [Joy] Yes. [Ingrid] I've done the same thing. [Joy] Yes.
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[Ingrid] So tell us about your experiences of schooling and what were your best and worst subjects. [Joy] Oh,because I was always talking I missed a lot of my English subject -subjects because [Ingrid] So tell us about your experiences of schooling and what were your best and worst subjects. [Joy] Oh,because I was always talking I missed a lot of my English subject -subjects because
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I was sitting outside writing words, so I would say lack of comfort- concentration with English and parts of history, but the other subjects I did well with with at school. Yes, [Ingrid] Okay. And where did you attend school? [Joy] Well at Bellevue Hill School and then went on to Randwick High. Yes. Both schools I loved very much. Yes. I was sitting outside writing words, so I would say lack of comfort- concentration with English and parts of history, but the other subjects I did well with with at school. Yes, [Ingrid] Okay. And where did you attend school? [Joy] Well at Bellevue Hill School and then went on to Randwick High. Yes. Both schools I loved very much. Yes.
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And what was your experience as a woman in the education system? And what was your experience as a woman in the education system?
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Experience was the camaraderie with the students that you um, Experience was the camaraderie with the students that you um,
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you're with at school and progressing each year with either the same students or missing ah meeting new ones. Yes. you're with at school and progressing each year with either the same students or missing ah meeting new ones. Yes.
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And the teachers. Of course they were always so helpful and I can't speak highly enough of the education system. As a matter of fact, I was invited when I was a Councillor to the speech day at Randwick High uh, to um, address over 1000 parents, And the teachers. Of course they were always so helpful and I can't speak highly enough of the education system. As a matter of fact, I was invited when I was a Councillor to the speech day at Randwick High uh, to um, address over 1000 parents,
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and tell them about my experience of um, being educated in the public system and how I moved on from Randwick High and where I went. I then went to Ultimo Technical College to do a commercial course and tell them about my experience of um, being educated in the public system and how I moved on from Randwick High and where I went. I then went to Ultimo Technical College to do a commercial course
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uh, as a stenographer and bookkeeper and where it led me in, into my career after that in legal profession, the Opal industry and mining, and then of course eventually a Councillor with Waverley Council. Yeah. [Ingrid] Yes. And yeah were you ever mentioned in a newspaper before becoming a councillor and being in the public eye. [Joy] Yes, numerous times uh, as a stenographer and bookkeeper and where it led me in, into my career after that in legal profession, the Opal industry and mining, and then of course eventually a Councillor with Waverley Council. Yeah. [Ingrid] Yes. And yeah were you ever mentioned in a newspaper before becoming a councillor and being in the public eye. [Joy] Yes, numerous times
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in the Opal industry, because uh, in the Opal industry, because uh,
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having been in the Opal industry since 1965, my husband was mining in South Australia in Andamooka, having been in the Opal industry since 1965, my husband was mining in South Australia in Andamooka,
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and uh, we had the greatest opportunity of displaying opal at the um showground in Moore Park for Rotary International and in 1970, and uh, in 5 days and uh, we had the greatest opportunity of displaying opal at the um showground in Moore Park for Rotary International and in 1970, and uh, in 5 days
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we we
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we met so many people and made so much money we could have bought a house outright. [Ingrid] My goodness. [Joy] Yes. And with the help of colleagues of my husbands on the opal field, they lent us a lot of stock for the exhibition. Of course we had thousands of Rotarians from around the world. we met so many people and made so much money we could have bought a house outright. [Ingrid] My goodness. [Joy] Yes. And with the help of colleagues of my husbands on the opal field, they lent us a lot of stock for the exhibition. Of course we had thousands of Rotarians from around the world.
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And that's what set us on a course to And that's what set us on a course to
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go overseas and set up a business eventually in America. go overseas and set up a business eventually in America.
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Yes. [Ingrid] So you've been to America as well. [Joy] 5, oh 5, nearly 5 years in America with our company, Yes. [Ingrid] So you've been to America as well. [Joy] 5, oh 5, nearly 5 years in America with our company,
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Harlequin Opal in America and that was very successful, Harlequin Opal in America and that was very successful,
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because my husband came back to Australia, would would buy the rough opal in, in Coober Pedy and then come back to America and we cut it over there with another colleague that we met in America, um, Dennis Dial, who's still got a business over, over in America. because my husband came back to Australia, would would buy the rough opal in, in Coober Pedy and then come back to America and we cut it over there with another colleague that we met in America, um, Dennis Dial, who's still got a business over, over in America.
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And we, uh, are used to travel. We And we, uh, are used to travel. We
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we lived first in Illinois, we lived first in Illinois,
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and then we moved over to Spring - uh, no, Springfield, Illinois, and then we moved over to Lindhurst in New Jersey and I used to come into Manhattan every day and sell opal. and then we moved over to Spring - uh, no, Springfield, Illinois, and then we moved over to Lindhurst in New Jersey and I used to come into Manhattan every day and sell opal.
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Yeah. Yeah.
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[Ingrid] Okay. And who were your particular friends that influenced your future career direction? [Joy] Oh I'd say my second husband. [Ingrid] Okay. And who were your particular friends that influenced your future career direction? [Joy] Oh I'd say my second husband.
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With regard to wanting to explore the amazing mineral resources of Australia. He was Greek. With regard to wanting to explore the amazing mineral resources of Australia. He was Greek.
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And his um, partner in business had studied geology and they both decided to go to South Australia and have a look at the opal fields because they learned so much, or George had learned so much about the amazing minerals within Australia and that's how we got started in the opal business. And his um, partner in business had studied geology and they both decided to go to South Australia and have a look at the opal fields because they learned so much, or George had learned so much about the amazing minerals within Australia and that's how we got started in the opal business.
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And we both learned to cut. And we both learned to cut.
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And uh, I went on to study gemology and jewellery making, And uh, I went on to study gemology and jewellery making,
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and uh, and uh,
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then Tony ended up, my second husband, ended up at an amazing cutter, so he used to cut and I used to market the opal, then Tony ended up, my second husband, ended up at an amazing cutter, so he used to cut and I used to market the opal,
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and sell to um, the shops in Sydney, and sell to um, the shops in Sydney,
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and interstate in South Australia, Melbourne, Queensland, and interstate in South Australia, Melbourne, Queensland,
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Western Australia. Used to travel all over the country selling. [Ingrid] You've been everywhere with your opals? [Joy] Yes, especially to the Outback, and I've got very fond memories when I was in Andamooka of um, Western Australia. Used to travel all over the country selling. [Ingrid] You've been everywhere with your opals? [Joy] Yes, especially to the Outback, and I've got very fond memories when I was in Andamooka of um,
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of one- one particular Aboriginal elder who was following me around in the local supermarket, which there was only one, of one- one particular Aboriginal elder who was following me around in the local supermarket, which there was only one,
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and uh, he came up and spoke to me, and he said, 'I can't stop looking at your hair.' [laughs] He said, he said, 'can I touch your hair?' And I had long hair at the time. and uh, he came up and spoke to me, and he said, 'I can't stop looking at your hair.' [laughs] He said, he said, 'can I touch your hair?' And I had long hair at the time.
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And I said 'yes, of course,' and we became quite friendly and they always know where you are - the Aboriginal people. They follow you around and they they know exactly where you are and your movements and where my husband and I were leaving in a car, we had the boot full of opal, And I said 'yes, of course,' and we became quite friendly and they always know where you are - the Aboriginal people. They follow you around and they they know exactly where you are and your movements and where my husband and I were leaving in a car, we had the boot full of opal,
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and all of a sudden this, this uh, broken down car came speeding up beside us as we're coming out of Andamooka on our way to Adelaide, and all of a sudden this, this uh, broken down car came speeding up beside us as we're coming out of Andamooka on our way to Adelaide,
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and pulled up in front of us, and all these Aboriginal people jumped out of the car and I thought, 'Oh my God, what's going to happen?' And they opened the door and then I recognised the elder and he said, 'I have something for you.' and he gave me a big box and pulled up in front of us, and all these Aboriginal people jumped out of the car and I thought, 'Oh my God, what's going to happen?' And they opened the door and then I recognised the elder and he said, 'I have something for you.' and he gave me a big box
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of opal specimens. That's what we call painted ladies, where it's the natural rock that you find Opal in with beautiful Opal on the surface, and he gave me this big box of painted ladies that they had and I just couldn't get over. It was amazing. He said, 'you and your husband have been so kind to us,' of opal specimens. That's what we call painted ladies, where it's the natural rock that you find Opal in with beautiful Opal on the surface, and he gave me this big box of painted ladies that they had and I just couldn't get over. It was amazing. He said, 'you and your husband have been so kind to us,'
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and given us some opal from time to time when they you know we're noodling around and they and Tony allowed them to noodle in the, in the mullock heaps. and given us some opal from time to time when they you know we're noodling around and they and Tony allowed them to noodle in the, in the mullock heaps.
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And he said 'thank you for all you've done for us,' and that was the thank you. [Ingrid] What a fabulous story. [Joy] It was amazing story. That's why when I met uh, And he said 'thank you for all you've done for us,' and that was the thank you. [Ingrid] What a fabulous story. [Joy] It was amazing story. That's why when I met uh,
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Dominic Wy Kanak at council, I relayed some of the stories to Dominic and he was fascinated and said, 'Aw that that's amazing.' And I've always had a very close connection with the Aboriginal community to the point where my grandson Dominic Wy Kanak at council, I relayed some of the stories to Dominic and he was fascinated and said, 'Aw that that's amazing.' And I've always had a very close connection with the Aboriginal community to the point where my grandson
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ended up with a job in the Northern Territory with one of the councils and he ended up with a job in the Northern Territory with one of the councils and he
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took on a position where by took on a position where by
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he went out to the uh, communities by plane with some of the colleagues from council and interviewed the Aboriginal elders with regard to issues that they have within their local communities in the Northern Territory. When he came back to Sydney he went out to the uh, communities by plane with some of the colleagues from council and interviewed the Aboriginal elders with regard to issues that they have within their local communities in the Northern Territory. When he came back to Sydney
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with that experience he had with 3 years in the Outback, he ended up, uh,  he now works for one of the senior ministers in the Australian government in uh, Macquarie Street. with that experience he had with 3 years in the Outback, he ended up, uh,  he now works for one of the senior ministers in the Australian government in uh, Macquarie Street.
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So that's where it's led him to, so that's what we used to do. [Ingrid] That's great to have all that first hand knowledge [Joy] Yes. And and as I said, he's got a So that's where it's led him to, so that's what we used to do. [Ingrid] That's great to have all that first hand knowledge [Joy] Yes. And and as I said, he's got a
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a wonderful background with the Aboriginal communities from the Northern Territory. a wonderful background with the Aboriginal communities from the Northern Territory.
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It runs in the family. It runs in the family.
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[Ingrid] So it does. [Joy]Yes. [Ingrid] Does he have the light colored hair too? [Joy] Yes. [Ingrid] So it does. [Joy]Yes. [Ingrid] Does he have the light colored hair too? [Joy] Yes.
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[Joy laughs] [Joy laughs]
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As a child, did you have any heroes or role models? As a child, did you have any heroes or role models?
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Role models. Role models.
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Oh well, um, I think my greatest role, my model was my mother. Oh well, um, I think my greatest role, my model was my mother.
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She had millinery shops and I always admired my mother 'cause she was so beautiful. She had blonde hair as you saw in the photo, and I always admired my mother and I thought how wonderful it would be to be as successful as my mother in business. She had millinery shops and I always admired my mother 'cause she was so beautiful. She had blonde hair as you saw in the photo, and I always admired my mother and I thought how wonderful it would be to be as successful as my mother in business.
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And that's - I went in different directions, but I, I still created a business for myself as well. Yeah. And that's - I went in different directions, but I, I still created a business for myself as well. Yeah.
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And my father was um, opened up a business in second hand pianos in Dulwich Hill in Marrickville, and they used to do up pianos and every Saturday I would go with my father to his shop in Dulwich Hill and play the piano, and he said some of his best um, clients And my father was um, opened up a business in second hand pianos in Dulwich Hill in Marrickville, and they used to do up pianos and every Saturday I would go with my father to his shop in Dulwich Hill and play the piano, and he said some of his best um, clients
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bought pianos on the Saturday mornings when I was playing as a child when I was 7 and 8 years of age playing the piano. bought pianos on the Saturday mornings when I was playing as a child when I was 7 and 8 years of age playing the piano.
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Yes. Yes.
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[Ingrid] So you were telling us about your female role model and we were going to take a pause there? Or do you want to go straight on? [Joy] No, we can go and continue. [Ingrid] So you were telling us about your female role model and we were going to take a pause there? Or do you want to go straight on? [Joy] No, we can go and continue.
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[Ingrid] Now, what world events had the most impact on you while you were growing up and did any of them... [Joy] Yes. [Ingrid] affect your choices in life in general, your working life? [Joy and Ingrid speak at same time] [Joy] One in particular affected me was the- I remember the day I was at my mother's shop. She had one in Glenayr Ave, a millinery shop 151 Glenayr Avenue. [Ingrid] Now, what world events had the most impact on you while you were growing up and did any of them... [Joy] Yes. [Ingrid] affect your choices in life in general, your working life? [Joy and Ingrid speak at same time] [Joy] One in particular affected me was the- I remember the day I was at my mother's shop. She had one in Glenayr Ave, a millinery shop 151 Glenayr Avenue.
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That day it was John F. Kennedy's assassination. That day it was John F. Kennedy's assassination.
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And it affected us all. And it affected us all.
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And uh, And uh,
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it's a day I'll never forget in 1963. it's a day I'll never forget in 1963.
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When he was assassinated, I think that, that stuck with me all these years because I had a great admiration for this young president, When he was assassinated, I think that, that stuck with me all these years because I had a great admiration for this young president,
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and what he was doing in the United States, so I suppose I've always and what he was doing in the United States, so I suppose I've always
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probably at the back of my mind, being interested in politics probably at the back of my mind, being interested in politics
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and that's, that's where it affected me, so much. Is having such a great statement- statesman die like that. and that's, that's where it affected me, so much. Is having such a great statement- statesman die like that.
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[Ingrid] Despite your interest, it really did. [Joy] Yes. [Ingrid] Despite your interest, it really did. [Joy] Yes.
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Did anyone in your family influence your education or work choices? Did anyone in your family influence your education or work choices?
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Not really. Um, Not really. Um,
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In those days it was In those days it was
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probably accepted that a-a young girl would become a stenographer, probably accepted that a-a young girl would become a stenographer,
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and that's exactly the uh, the path I followed because a lot of my girlfriends got involved in the commercial field, either as bookkeepers, stenographers. and that's exactly the uh, the path I followed because a lot of my girlfriends got involved in the commercial field, either as bookkeepers, stenographers.
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And that's what women basically did in those days, And that's what women basically did in those days,
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because, you know, they didn't take interest in other things until much later. And [Ingrid] Yeah, the social expectation. [Joy] That's right, yes. And that's what parents exact or you could become a nurse and I wasn't interested in nursing at that stage. because, you know, they didn't take interest in other things until much later. And [Ingrid] Yeah, the social expectation. [Joy] That's right, yes. And that's what parents exact or you could become a nurse and I wasn't interested in nursing at that stage.
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[Ingrid] Were there life choices that affected your career? Your decision to become elected as a councillor, say marriage or having children? Other events. [Joy] I had one daughter but, uh, [Ingrid] Were there life choices that affected your career? Your decision to become elected as a councillor, say marriage or having children? Other events. [Joy] I had one daughter but, uh,
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everything in my life was an accident. everything in my life was an accident.
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Everything, you know, working. My first job was at 2GB Macquarie as a junior stenographer. Everything, you know, working. My first job was at 2GB Macquarie as a junior stenographer.
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And then I spent another year at uh, Suit X. They were swimsuit manufacturers from America and I was the secretary there and did dot- the dogsbody. Did everything. And then I spent another year at uh, Suit X. They were swimsuit manufacturers from America and I was the secretary there and did dot- the dogsbody. Did everything.
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And then got married, And then got married,
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and um, and um,
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took time out to have a little one, my daughter, Kim. took time out to have a little one, my daughter, Kim.
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And then I got a job in the film industry. And then I got a job in the film industry.
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I worked with S T Hodge when Kim was young. They're solicitors and I enjoyed that but then I moved sideways into the film industry. Got a very good job in uh, Eric Porter Productions. Stayed there for nearly 7 years as the Managing Director Secretary. I worked with S T Hodge when Kim was young. They're solicitors and I enjoyed that but then I moved sideways into the film industry. Got a very good job in uh, Eric Porter Productions. Stayed there for nearly 7 years as the Managing Director Secretary.
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And did all sorts of things. Jack of all trades. And did all sorts of things. Jack of all trades.
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Do you remember your first encounter with a woman in local government? Do you remember your first encounter with a woman in local government?
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Uh, yes I I would say Uh, yes I I would say
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the woman I admired when I- back in the days I was in the Liberal Party and the woman I admired when I- back in the days I was in the Liberal Party and
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1957, joined for a short time and then I met my husband at one of the social events and we married and I didn't get back into politics until 1983. 1957, joined for a short time and then I met my husband at one of the social events and we married and I didn't get back into politics until 1983.
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And uh, And uh,
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I was most impressed with our local Member, wh- who was um Rosemary Foot. I was most impressed with our local Member, wh- who was um Rosemary Foot.
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And I was most taken with Rosemary because of her achievements. And I was most taken with Rosemary because of her achievements.
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?Okay? ?Okay?
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How did you come to choose Waverley? To choose to become a Waverley councillor? And what was your motivation? [Joy] Ah. Well. How did you come to choose Waverley? To choose to become a Waverley councillor? And what was your motivation? [Joy] Ah. Well.
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Peter Debnam at the time was the President of the Bellevue Hill branches, where where I first joined the party in '83 and I became the Secretary of that branch, and Peter was the President. And of course Peter went on to become the member for Vaucluse after Rosemary Foot, and Peter suggested I get involved in Waverley Council and he more or less was responsible for Peter Debnam at the time was the President of the Bellevue Hill branches, where where I first joined the party in '83 and I became the Secretary of that branch, and Peter was the President. And of course Peter went on to become the member for Vaucluse after Rosemary Foot, and Peter suggested I get involved in Waverley Council and he more or less was responsible for
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my direction in that in that uh, my direction in that in that uh,
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order order
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and I did uh, apply and I did uh, apply
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to become a councillor in 1991. to become a councillor in 1991.
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And I was number 1 on the ticket in Bondi and unfortunately my mother died in the August and the elections were in the September and I stepped back because, And I was number 1 on the ticket in Bondi and unfortunately my mother died in the August and the elections were in the September and I stepped back because,
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you know, losing my mother. you know, losing my mother.
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And um, David Jeffrey's took the number one position and, and he won the number 1 position. I didn't as number 2 on the ticket and it wasn't until 2004. I was running on tickets uh, in between with um And um, David Jeffrey's took the number one position and, and he won the number 1 position. I didn't as number 2 on the ticket and it wasn't until 2004. I was running on tickets uh, in between with um
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in the Waverley ward, but it wasn't until 2004 that I ran again in the Bondi ward and got the selection in 2004. in the Waverley ward, but it wasn't until 2004 that I ran again in the Bondi ward and got the selection in 2004.
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[Ingrid] How long did you serve on council? [Joy] 13 years. [Ingrid] Such a long time. [Joy] Yes. [Ingrid] How long did you serve on council? [Joy] 13 years. [Ingrid] Such a long time. [Joy] Yes.
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[Ingrid] And under what circumstances did you leave the position? [Joy] Oh, I left the position because I thought it was time to retire. I was 79 years of age and I thought, you know, I had a young man that helped me in my campaign [Ingrid] And under what circumstances did you leave the position? [Joy] Oh, I left the position because I thought it was time to retire. I was 79 years of age and I thought, you know, I had a young man that helped me in my campaign
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and I thought, move aside so some of the younger people can come through. and I thought, move aside so some of the younger people can come through.
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And they had fresh ideas and I thought that was the appropriate time for me to, And they had fresh ideas and I thought that was the appropriate time for me to,
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to retire at 79. to retire at 79.
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I understand that. I understand that.
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What accomplish- accomplishments while serving as councillor are you most proud of that you would like people to remember about you as a Waverley Councillor? [Joy] Um, accomplishments, um, What accomplish- accomplishments while serving as councillor are you most proud of that you would like people to remember about you as a Waverley Councillor? [Joy] Um, accomplishments, um,
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I was very focused on -there was a lot of graffiti in the municipality so I took on that I was very focused on -there was a lot of graffiti in the municipality so I took on that
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decision decision
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to focus on getting rid of graffiti. So I used to go round the streets noting where the graffiti was and uh, coming back to council and saying let's get rid of that and eventually council had a special truck that went around and removed graffiti and uh, which was great because that initiative worked very well. You know as we reported it as councillors the truck would go round and remove it. to focus on getting rid of graffiti. So I used to go round the streets noting where the graffiti was and uh, coming back to council and saying let's get rid of that and eventually council had a special truck that went around and removed graffiti and uh, which was great because that initiative worked very well. You know as we reported it as councillors the truck would go round and remove it.
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Also, Peter Debnam as the local member took on the responsibility every year of having a graffiti cleanup day, and I would go out with Peter and a few volunteers and we'd clean up big areas, like under the Syd Einfeld Drive. You know the walls at the back were covered in graffiti and we would paint all those walls at the back from Newland Street up to on nearly Adelaide - er, Junction Street. Yes. Also, Peter Debnam as the local member took on the responsibility every year of having a graffiti cleanup day, and I would go out with Peter and a few volunteers and we'd clean up big areas, like under the Syd Einfeld Drive. You know the walls at the back were covered in graffiti and we would paint all those walls at the back from Newland Street up to on nearly Adelaide - er, Junction Street. Yes.
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Clean those walls up and plus um, Reddam school had a- have a, Clean those walls up and plus um, Reddam school had a- have a,
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what is it? An area where they play um, sport on the corner of Blair Street and Mitchell Street and there was always graffiti on the back wall so we clean that up every year as well and other areas that we thought were suitable to clean up large areas. Unfortunately yeah. [Ingrid] It's a large area under the Syd Einfeld and it's a perfect place for people to want to paint their graffiti. [Joy] So the larger areas we what is it? An area where they play um, sport on the corner of Blair Street and Mitchell Street and there was always graffiti on the back wall so we clean that up every year as well and other areas that we thought were suitable to clean up large areas. Unfortunately yeah. [Ingrid] It's a large area under the Syd Einfeld and it's a perfect place for people to want to paint their graffiti. [Joy] So the larger areas we
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took on with regard to Clean Up took on with regard to Clean Up
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Australia Day. And I've got some uh, clippings of a couple of those. And Malcolm Turnbull was there in one of them helping us clean up one of the areas in Blair Street, I think it was. Australia Day. And I've got some uh, clippings of a couple of those. And Malcolm Turnbull was there in one of them helping us clean up one of the areas in Blair Street, I think it was.
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And that was a great achievement because I can reflect now back and say we're not seeing graffiti today like we did when I first got on to Council. So it's obviously made a difference. And the other thing, And that was a great achievement because I can reflect now back and say we're not seeing graffiti today like we did when I first got on to Council. So it's obviously made a difference. And the other thing,
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I um, I um,
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I took the challenge of bringing to Council's notice all the bill posters. I counted on one of the electric electric poles up in old South Head Road, 15 bill posters on 1 pole and I thought we've got to get rid of that, to the point where Council eventually had a permanent guy going down Old South Head Road removing them as soon as they were put up and I think Woollahra council took I took the challenge of bringing to Council's notice all the bill posters. I counted on one of the electric electric poles up in old South Head Road, 15 bill posters on 1 pole and I thought we've got to get rid of that, to the point where Council eventually had a permanent guy going down Old South Head Road removing them as soon as they were put up and I think Woollahra council took
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the initiative from us as well, and did the same thing on the other side of Old South Head Road and other areas of their municipality as well. the initiative from us as well, and did the same thing on the other side of Old South Head Road and other areas of their municipality as well.
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But um, what Woollahra -  I just remembered something. Woollahra were very impressed by our graffiti policy that Waverley had put together and they asked uh, I think it was Isabel Shapiro, asked me if they could borrow a copy of our graffiti policies so that they could look at doing something very similar in Woollahra. So I'm very proud of what Waverley did with regard to the graffiti policy and the bill But um, what Woollahra -  I just remembered something. Woollahra were very impressed by our graffiti policy that Waverley had put together and they asked uh, I think it was Isabel Shapiro, asked me if they could borrow a copy of our graffiti policies so that they could look at doing something very similar in Woollahra. So I'm very proud of what Waverley did with regard to the graffiti policy and the bill
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poster policy. poster policy.
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[Ingrid] That must have been very satisfying to have. [Joy] Oh it was. It was major community benefits in the long run. [Ingrid] That must have been very satisfying to have. [Joy] Oh it was. It was major community benefits in the long run.
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And uh, doing things like that, I think, very satisfying for me rather than some of the other things that happened. And uh, doing things like that, I think, very satisfying for me rather than some of the other things that happened.
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How did you find working with other councillors? How did you find working with other councillors?
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Generally um, fine. Generally um, fine.
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On a personal level, always got on well with all the councillors and all the staff. On a personal level, always got on well with all the councillors and all the staff.
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In the Chamber In the Chamber
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I was not happy with I was not happy with
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political point scoring. political point scoring.
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My personal opinion is it has no My personal opinion is it has no
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place in Council. We're there to make good decisions for the Council and the Community, and as I said, that's my personal decision and not enough that happened. There was too much point scoring and not enough place in Council. We're there to make good decisions for the Council and the Community, and as I said, that's my personal decision and not enough that happened. There was too much point scoring and not enough
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focus on what the outcomes were for the benefit of council and the community. focus on what the outcomes were for the benefit of council and the community.
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[Ingrid] And is there a community event or celebration during your time as councillor that has special importance for you? [Joy] Oh yes. Um, I became a member of the Historical Society and working with um, Peter McCallum and Audrey [Ingrid] And is there a community event or celebration during your time as councillor that has special importance for you? [Joy] Oh yes. Um, I became a member of the Historical Society and working with um, Peter McCallum and Audrey
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were some of the best days I've ever had, there's such a delightful couple, and to see them both recognized before Peter's passing were some of the best days I've ever had, there's such a delightful couple, and to see them both recognized before Peter's passing
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in w- ah, Waverley at Bronte Beach was the highlight for me and I'm sure for the family to see them recognized for all the work they've done for the community. in w- ah, Waverley at Bronte Beach was the highlight for me and I'm sure for the family to see them recognized for all the work they've done for the community.
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Wonderful couple, and I miss Peter terribly. [Ingrid] Yes. [Joy] Yes. [Ingrid] But it was lovely, like you say, that it happened before he did pass. [Joy] Yes, it was great. So after Peter's passing um, Wonderful couple, and I miss Peter terribly. [Ingrid] Yes. [Joy] Yes. [Ingrid] But it was lovely, like you say, that it happened before he did pass. [Joy] Yes, it was great. So after Peter's passing um,
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he asked me to become uh - she stepped in as president and she asked me to become vice and I was really deeply honored, he asked me to become uh - she stepped in as president and she asked me to become vice and I was really deeply honored,
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to be asked to step in as vice president. So that's where I am today. Eventually, we'll get back to our meetings again. [Ingrid] We will eventually. Yes. [Joy] Yes. And the second thing was meeting someone extraordinary like um, to be asked to step in as vice president. So that's where I am today. Eventually, we'll get back to our meetings again. [Ingrid] We will eventually. Yes. [Joy] Yes. And the second thing was meeting someone extraordinary like um,
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Gwen Gwen
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Bullivant. Bullivant.
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Gwen is the president of the Waverley Community Seniors Association, and she is another remarkable woman. So working with her with the seniors has- has just been delightful. And I've I've enjoyed every minute of it. Gwen is the president of the Waverley Community Seniors Association, and she is another remarkable woman. So working with her with the seniors has- has just been delightful. And I've I've enjoyed every minute of it.
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And the third one was of course being a JP. And when Waverley opened their- Waverley, opened their JP desk in 2008 And the third one was of course being a JP. And when Waverley opened their- Waverley, opened their JP desk in 2008
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I was one of the first volunteers to sit on the Waverley desk and I've been a volunteer JP on that desk since 2008 and that was wonderful, too. Meeting so many I was one of the first volunteers to sit on the Waverley desk and I've been a volunteer JP on that desk since 2008 and that was wonderful, too. Meeting so many
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people. people.
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And uh, And uh,
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it was quite extraordinary, sitting there as a JP. Somebody say, 'Gee, I know your face.'  it was quite extraordinary, sitting there as a JP. Somebody say, 'Gee, I know your face.' 
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And then all of a sudden they'd say, 'aren't you a councillor?' I'd say 'yes.' And then all of a sudden they'd say, 'aren't you a councillor?' I'd say 'yes.'
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Yes, so you'd meet so many delightful people in the community as well. [Ingrid] And of course, now you come and do your JP services down here at the library too. [Joy] Yes, yeah. Well, that's right. We opened that a couple of years ago here at the library. Yes, so you'd meet so many delightful people in the community as well. [Ingrid] And of course, now you come and do your JP services down here at the library too. [Joy] Yes, yeah. Well, that's right. We opened that a couple of years ago here at the library.
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But unfortunately, due to circumstances at the present, uh, we've only got the service available at the service center and not back at the library just yet. [Ingrid] Not yet soon, we hope. [Joy] Soon, yes. But unfortunately, due to circumstances at the present, uh, we've only got the service available at the service center and not back at the library just yet. [Ingrid] Not yet soon, we hope. [Joy] Soon, yes.
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[Ingrid] And what was your most humorous recollection during your time serving in Council? [Joy] Humorous? [Ingrid] Yes. [Joy] Ah, was seeing my colleagues dressed up for one of the Christmas parties. You know, the photograph of the mayor. They were dressed up as the um, oh, goodness gracious. [Ingrid] And what was your most humorous recollection during your time serving in Council? [Joy] Humorous? [Ingrid] Yes. [Joy] Ah, was seeing my colleagues dressed up for one of the Christmas parties. You know, the photograph of the mayor. They were dressed up as the um, oh, goodness gracious.
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As uh, As uh,
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characters, characters,
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like the King of Spades, I think uh, one of them was dressed up as a rabbit and it was. I've got the photo there anyway. [Ingrid] From Alice in Wonderland or something. [Joy] That's what it was, Alice in Wonderland. And as soon as I saw the mayor, like the King of Spades, I think uh, one of them was dressed up as a rabbit and it was. I've got the photo there anyway. [Ingrid] From Alice in Wonderland or something. [Joy] That's what it was, Alice in Wonderland. And as soon as I saw the mayor,
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Leon and Angela, Leon and Angela,
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I just cracked up I just cracked up
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'cause they looked so funny. [Ingrid] Normally so serious. [Joy] that was the highlight of seeing them dressed up as Alice in Wonderland characters with their pink. Angela and Sally with their pink, uh 'cause they looked so funny. [Ingrid] Normally so serious. [Joy] that was the highlight of seeing them dressed up as Alice in Wonderland characters with their pink. Angela and Sally with their pink, uh
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hairpieces. Oh, goodness gracious, I won't forget the look on hairpieces. Oh, goodness gracious, I won't forget the look on
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on my face, yes. on my face, yes.
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Okay so, is there anything else you'd like to add 'cause we're coming to the close of our interview here? Okay so, is there anything else you'd like to add 'cause we're coming to the close of our interview here?
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Um, Um,
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look, I've been blessed. That's all I can say. I've been blessed. I've had a wonderful family I've got look, I've been blessed. That's all I can say. I've been blessed. I've had a wonderful family I've got
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an amazing daughter that keeps on sending me presents all the time from the Gold Coast. an amazing daughter that keeps on sending me presents all the time from the Gold Coast.
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And she even buys me clothes. She knows exactly what size I am. She buys me shoes and clothes and sends them down to me. Now that I'm retired. And she even buys me clothes. She knows exactly what size I am. She buys me shoes and clothes and sends them down to me. Now that I'm retired.
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And, uh, and before that anyway. And, uh, and before that anyway.
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And uh, she works in age care. Big job she's got up in Queensland. And uh, she works in age care. Big job she's got up in Queensland.
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And I've got three amazing ground- grandchildren. My granddaughter's in ah, Canada with her husband working, And I've got three amazing ground- grandchildren. My granddaughter's in ah, Canada with her husband working,
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and my grandson Ben is working with councils on the Gold Coast because he has a big earthmoving business that he's developed in the last couple of years whereby he builds roads, car parks, all that sort of thing. and my grandson Ben is working with councils on the Gold Coast because he has a big earthmoving business that he's developed in the last couple of years whereby he builds roads, car parks, all that sort of thing.
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And he's doing very well. And he's doing very well.
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And uh, I've got two great grandchildren, two boys with my eldest grandson, Ben and Toby have got these two lovely boys. And uh, I've got two great grandchildren, two boys with my eldest grandson, Ben and Toby have got these two lovely boys.
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And one's 8 and one's 6. And one's 8 and one's 6.
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And as I said, as a family, I've been totally blessed. They're all so wonderful and supportive. And as I said, as a family, I've been totally blessed. They're all so wonderful and supportive.
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So it's really great and life, having the experiences So it's really great and life, having the experiences
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in the Opal business, which has taken me around the world. in the Opal business, which has taken me around the world.
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And at one stage I was the first female And at one stage I was the first female
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Federal President of the Australian Opal and Gem Industry Association in 1993, when Opal was declared Australia's national gemstone in South Australia, we had a big function in South Australia where um, the Minister Bolkus, I've forgotten his first name, was the Minister for Mineral Resources in those days, Federal President of the Australian Opal and Gem Industry Association in 1993, when Opal was declared Australia's national gemstone in South Australia, we had a big function in South Australia where um, the Minister Bolkus, I've forgotten his first name, was the Minister for Mineral Resources in those days,
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and we presented him with with an opal on the day for and we presented him with with an opal on the day for
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being responsible for the declaration for Opal and that was great for the industry and being president, that was another highlight of my life. Is seeing Opal acknowledged because Australia supplies over about 95% of world consumption of Opal, being responsible for the declaration for Opal and that was great for the industry and being president, that was another highlight of my life. Is seeing Opal acknowledged because Australia supplies over about 95% of world consumption of Opal,
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as well as having wonderful mineral resources with diamonds as well as having wonderful mineral resources with diamonds
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sapphires, we've got chrysoprase, um, emeralds in various parts of Australia. sapphires, we've got chrysoprase, um, emeralds in various parts of Australia.
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Um, Um,
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it's just amazing the mineral wealth this country has a lot of people don't it's just amazing the mineral wealth this country has a lot of people don't
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understand that and, and of course Australia produced the best pink and red diamonds... [Ingrid] It does. [Joy] In the world. So we've got a lot to be thankful for. What this country offers. understand that and, and of course Australia produced the best pink and red diamonds... [Ingrid] It does. [Joy] In the world. So we've got a lot to be thankful for. What this country offers.
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Yeah. Yeah.
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[Ingrid] I think we might finish there. [Joy] Okay. [Ingrid] Thank you Joy Clayton, for that has really been very interesting. Listening and speaking to you. [Ingrid] I think we might finish there. [Joy] Okay. [Ingrid] Thank you Joy Clayton, for that has really been very interesting. Listening and speaking to you.
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And this is the end of the interview with Joy Clayton for the women in local government oral history project, coinciding with International Women's Day 2020. Celebrating 100 years of women in local government. [Joy] Thank you. [Ingrid] That's my pleasure. Thank you. And this is the end of the interview with Joy Clayton for the women in local government oral history project, coinciding with International Women's Day 2020. Celebrating 100 years of women in local government. [Joy] Thank you. [Ingrid] That's my pleasure. Thank you.